Swaybar Disconnects - Ford Raptor

[Bojangles]

Has anyone driven the Raptor with and without a swaybar? I'm not sure anyone but Bo and I have that have been responding??

Julian (Raptorguy21) has been without a swaybar for quite some time. He even tows a 25 foot Cobalt pimp-daddy boat without it, in fact. He was the one who convinced me to try taking mine off (and I love it). Some of you guys may consider guys like us and bstoner and A.I.I. Raciing unsafe or reckless, and I for one can accept that. I don't always follow the rules, and I'm performance oriented when it comes to vehicles. We're alsoprobably out running in the desert more often than most Raptor owners as we live in the Desert Southwest.
I don't necessarily subscribe to the idea that a swaybar is mandatory on-road for a vehicle that is as wide as the Raptor. ....my opinion.
I'm also not terrified of my insurance guy, again, that's just me. I'm more than willing to take some risks for a good time.

I didn't buy the Raptor to go fast offroad...I do/try things that make it handle better offroad. Again it's all about what you want to do with your truck and if you are comfortable with the handling characteristics.

Huh???? I think you've been living up to your last name:badger:, cause I'm pretty sure you meant to say was "I didn't buy the Raptor to go fast ONroad"

...and I didn't either. Do I do 80 on the freeway.... yes. But it's 80 cruising, not 80 on some paved mountain switchback. I also don't do burnouts on the street and challenge people to stoplight drag races.... (there are other fun cars built for that.... put me in a Z06 and i'm all over that stuff)
Anyhow, my point is, when I wanna drive like a maniac in this thing, it ain't on the pavement. I've hit 100mph in my Raptor off-road, but I also knew my terrain and didn't turn the wheel at that speed because I'm not a *******. I've also been to few Skip Barber and Bragg-Smith Racing and High-Performance Driving schools, so I'm familiar being comfortable and ready to react to a vehicle at very high speeds in turns, mid-drift, etc. (now I'm jonesing to go to an off-road racing school)

I'm aware of the risks and willing to take them for what I consider to be a heightened off-road experience (which I do several times a week). If I was going on a long road trip or towing, I might pop my swaybar back in, but after having EXPERIENCED both ways, I'm comfortable without it in daily driving.

There are obviously two schools of thought here, but I can appreciate that this has been a spirited yet thoughtful and respectful debate.

 

[MagicMtnDan]

Excellent input Jason, thanks! Nothing like experience to add value to the discussion.

I didn't buy the Raptor to go fast offroad...

 

[bstoner59]

Did you recover from the golfing incident? hehehehe

We should set up an SVT OFFROAD legal fund for all of us hooligans!!

FYI, 1980's Flash Gordon is an AWESOME movie!!

I rock those golf carts like no ones business....

I like the legal fund....oh I have a friend that sells movie and legal service. He's been telling me I can male a bundle...maybe this can be my first account!?!!??!?

Julian (Raptorguy21) has been without a swaybar for quite some time. He even tows a 25 foot Cobalt pimp-daddy boat without it, in fact. He was the one who convinced me to try taking mine off (and I love it). Some of you guys may consider guys like us and bstoner and A.I.I. Raciing unsafe or reckless, and I for one can accept that. I don't always follow the rules, and I'm performance oriented when it comes to vehicles. We're alsoprobably out running in the desert more often than most Raptor owners as we live in the Desert Southwest.
I don't necessarily subscribe to the idea that a swaybar is mandatory on-road for a vehicle that is as wide as the Raptor. ....my opinion.
I'm also not terrified of my insurance guy, again, that's just me. I'm more than willing to take some risks for a good time.





Huh???? I think you've been living up to your last name:badger:, cause I'm pretty sure you meant to say was "I didn't buy the Raptor to go fast ONroad"

...and I didn't either. Do I do 80 on the freeway.... yes. But it's 80 cruising, not 80 on some paved mountain switchback. I also don't do burnouts on the street and challenge people to stoplight drag races.... (there are other fun cars built for that.... put me in a Z06 and i'm all over that stuff)
Anyhow, my point is, when I wanna drive like a maniac in this thing, it ain't on the pavement. I've hit 100mph in my Raptor off-road, but I also knew my terrain and didn't turn the wheel at that speed because I'm not a *******. I've also been to few Skip Barber and Bragg-Smith Racing and High-Performance Driving schools, so I'm familiar being comfortable and ready to react to a vehicle at very high speeds in turns, mid-drift, etc. (now I'm jonesing to go to an off-road racing school)

I'm aware of the risks and willing to take them for what I consider to be a heightened off-road experience (which I do several times a week). If I was going on a long road trip or towing, I might pop my swaybar back in, but after having EXPERIENCED both ways, I'm comfortable without it in daily driving.

There are obviously two schools of thought here, but I can appreciate that this has been a spirited yet thoughtful and respectful debate.

My dad told me not to wake n bake anymore

Excellent input Jason, thanks! Nothing like experience to add value to the discussion.

Did Carissa send you that pic??

 

[MarkT]

SNIP

My only comment, and it's a redundant one, is that Jeeps are very different than the Raptor. Rarely (if ever) do you see a Jeep flying across terrain at the rate of speed the Raptor is capable of going in stock form.

My question to the the readers is how much value does the Raptor's anti-sway bar have OFFroad? One response could be, "A lot more than a Jeep's anti-sway bar would have."

One HUGE flaw to this question. The Raptor is NOT A JEEP. The question makes the assumption that the type of driving affects the need for the anti-sway bar when in fact it is the design of the suspension and vehicle that is the critical factor. Some suspension designs need HUGE anti-sway bars to work properly. Others need no anti-sway bars at all!

The Raptor comes with a one pretty wimpy (and probably not very effective front bar) and no rear bar. You can't compare removing the Raptor bar to anything but a Raptor...

 

[bstoner59]

Yeah...like he said

 

[The Tank]

My head hurts..........

 

[MagicMtnDan]

Mark, the intention of my inarticulately written post was not to compare the Jeep to the Raptor. I was trying to compare the type of offroad driving those two vehicles are typically used for. One rarely, if ever, sees a stock Jeep being driven quickly offroad (and we all know why - short wheelbase, high COG, not designed for it, etc.) but the Raptor is a horse of a different color.

 

[The Tank]

Mark, the intention of my inarticulately written post was not to compare the Jeep to the Raptor. I was trying to compare the type of offroad driving those two vehicles are typically used for. One rarely, if ever, sees a stock Jeep being driven quickly offroad (and we all know why - short wheelbase, high COG, not designed for it, etc.) but the Raptor is a horse of a different color.

Does the Mopar/KORE suspension for Rams have sway bars? that is about the closest thing you are going to find to a Raptor

 

[MarkT]

Mark, the intention of my inarticulately written post was not to compare the Jeep to the Raptor. I was trying to compare the type of offroad driving those two vehicles are typically used for. One rarely, if ever, sees a stock Jeep being driven quickly offroad (and we all know why - short wheelbase, high COG, not designed for it, etc.) but the Raptor is a horse of a different color.

First, my apologies if I offended you Dan. That was not my intent.

And I give my response a big "FAIL" because it may have come across as an "attack" and apparently I failed to make my point.

The fact is that you can drive very quickly and safely with or without anti-sway bars... as long as the suspension is designed properly. And a "properly designed" suspension does not need anti-sway bars at all!

The "big bars/soft springs" vs. "soft bars/stiff springs" debate has been going on for as long as I can remember. Two different approaches to achieving the same result.

The approach I prefer is "soft bars/stiff springs" where the anti-sway bars do little more than fine tune the handling... and sometimes are disconnected completely. I feel this is the approach Ford took with the Raptor.

On most production vehicles, the anti-sway bar is part of a "big bar/soft spring" approach. Obviously, removing an anti-sway bar would have a huge effect on a vehicle that relied heavily on the anti-sway bar to provide safe handling characteristics.

You simply can't compare what Jeep, Mopar, or even Ford did on a different vehicle with regards to anti-sway bars. The only valid comparison is "Raptor with" to "Raptor without".

Now back to the Jeep. Jeep sway bar disconnects are generally used only at low speeds. Extremely valid point! But the Jeep design relies heavily on anti-sway bars to provide safe handling characteristics at high speed! Just because a Jeep (or any other vehicle) needs anti-sway bars at high speeds does not mean the Raptor does...

I'll end this ramble with a question:

What would happen to the high speed on-road handling if someone decided to put a larger anti-sway bar on the front of the Raptor? Say twice as big? Wouldn't that be safer? Less roll or sway, right?

Except for one thing. The terms "anti-sway" or "anti-roll" or "sway" bar is somewhat of a misnomer. What these terms refer to is really a weight transfer tuning device to adjust the handling.

A larger front bar would increase understeer. You'd turn the steering wheel and the truck would continue to go straight. Ralph Nader would approve. :mrgreen:

 

[bstoner59]

My softball hurts