Outlaw vs RPG vs Brenthel

[bstoner59]

Oh wow...I go off-roading and look what I miss out on. I had more fun playing with my puny 11" of travel!!

 

[Squatting Dog]

Oh wow...I go off-roading and look what I miss out on. I had more fun playing with my puny 11" of travel!!

It is not how much travel you have, but how you use it!

-Greg

 

[RPG]

Typically when these types of conversations raise their ugly little heads I try to stay as far away from them as possible. Nothing good ever comes from them and they typically end up being nothing more than an exercise in mental ************. The way I see it, the op asked a question about long travel kits looking for honest opinions and somehow the thread turned into personal attacks.

I find it sad that hundreds of people log into this forum everyday to have a good time, B.S. with other likeminded Raptor owners and end up having to read trash like this. The statements from Scott is so far from reality and the truth that I have found myself scratching my head in disbelief. Every vendor on this forum works day-in and day-out to keep the masses of Raptor fanatics happy, and RPG is no different. We are just over 1 year old as a company and still have a long way to go. Companies like SDHQ, ADD, Outlaw and others have cut their teeth in a very competitive and fast pace business. Each one has their own special talents, and each one has their own way of doing business. Each one is passionate about their respective products, and each has progressed the Raptor in a very short period of time to unseen heights and magnitude. I personally admire each one of them, and can only hope that one day RPG can match all of them in their success.

For those of you who are reading this and asking themselves is this sincere? I can promise you it is. This past weekend I was invited to go with a few forum members on a run that haven’t always been our biggest fans. The two members are staunch supporters of our competitors and we haven’t always seen eye to eye. Yet somehow a few months ago we were able to put differences aside and npw talk quite often and are trying to plan a few trips together in the near future. The point of me telling you all this is that even though an infinitesimal number of members are trying to stir the pot for the sake of their own sanity, Raptor land is actually rather drama free at the moment. I personally have no desire to participate in the destruction of perfectly good bandwidth to play their little games. Jarrod from ADD once told me “you live by the web, you die by the web”. I have never forgotten this comment because it’s so true. Anyone can say anything and as a business owner I have seen the darkest side of this. Over the past year I have battled PM’s that are outright lies. I have spent hours typing emails to ensure the record was set straight. At the end of the day my number one focus is on making sure our customers come first because that is what really matters. Many of you have entrusted us with your trucks and we take that very seriously and I’ll be dammed if the ranting and ravings of a select few will ever derail that focus.

As Chris Ross said, in the upcoming weeks we will be performing suspension tuning with Fox to make sure his truck is everything he has imagined. In a very short time this truck has gone through a full overhaul and cosmetically has turned out stunning. Every bit of the truck is going to plan and when it goes through its proper testing, and drives and performs as we know it will, we will then show every ounce of what went into it. I welcome the long travel discussion, and can’t wait for the day I’m able to release the video of it doing its thing. I truly enjoy the scrutiny this truck is going through because I know it will be nothing short of amazing upon 100% completion. It has been the work of many highly talented and accomplished people in the off-road industry, and I can promise you all, the video will be able to express what my fingers cannot on the keyboard.

Enjoy the rest of your Thanksgiving weekend everybody.

Jarrett

 

[Kanakry]

Jarrett,

I am glad that RPG and other companies are pushing the boundaries of what the Raptor can do.

I can't wait to see the truck!

 

[Squatting Dog]

Competition is the best thing for the Raptor owners/community. If it was not for the vendors/customers pushing the limits of the Raptor we would stuck ****** products like RECON!


-Greg

 

[BigScott]

LOL... I'm alway the ass for pointing that stuff out.. Glad to see that I'm not the only one that catches the "sick bra, gnar gnar, monster & hair gel" sales wording...

The upper arm was designed to be beefy enough to handle a bump if that was the set up they wanted to go with.

---------- Post added at 01:18 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:15 PM ----------



Ours is running a bump, if you look at the pics it is the red part between the coil over & bypass.

Is it D A N H Q well someone has to be the ass right ! We can take turns

 

[BigScott]

Uca looks like the one on the FMI (Gregg Foutz) Sanderson Ford truck at S.E.M.A ?

We went to Foutz in 2010 to help us design our LT in CAD since we were planning on offering this as a kit and not just a one off piece. Not sure if the kit he used on that truck is the same or very similar.

Well I did not get a picture of it at SEMA or I would post or send to you.

OOPS did I just start a copy right war ? Oh crap ? Now Greg will REALLY be pissed at me.

Hey the good news is B J Baldwin won the Baja 1000 overall !

Yeah right "just a crazy fan pulled in front of us"

---------- Post added at 02:43 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:28 AM ----------

I thought as long as I was chiming in on this, I would also speak about why I chose to allow RPG to use my truck as the guinea pig for this suspension.

I assure you that it had nothing to do with the ruts that trophy truck leave in the desert. While this makes a little sense, it also is a statement that is so easy to tear apart.

I decided to go down this route for one reason only. I love the idea of lots of travel, but I DESPISE the look of all the trucks that the wheels stick so far out from the side of the truck. Or that that have unnatural looking fender flares to cover the wheels.

I love that we have kept the truck clean looking, been successful in running 39's, and we shall se where the number come out on travel. My guess is that if we use this new term of "Fully usable travel" it will be closer to 18" than 19". Maybe even 17.5. Who Knows. Hard bump to Hard bump it is over 19.

Again the truck has not been off-road yet so I can not boast of how insane it performs, and I am 100% sure that it will require some tweaking to make it live up to my expectations.

I am however certain that it lives up to my expectations of how I wanted my truck to look. And anybody who has seen the truck in person, i am sure they will agree, it looks SICK. Now it is just about time to make sure it performs the same.

Yes it is quite awsome looking, Not knocking you or your truck. Like I stated eailier I was under your truck on the phone with Corey pointing out a few things that needed addressing. I am sure some things will be looked into.

I love the line "unnatural looking fender flairs" That's one of the reasons why you want a truck like this ?
Wide stance does limit your parking space options, drive thru fast food places, parrallell parking at the beach is off limits, need I go on ?

I have pictures and the one I laughed at was on blue tape across the front diff "NEEDS OIL"
I have not and will not post any of those without your permission.

---------- Post added at 02:52 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:43 AM ----------

OK before I was trying to be nice and political. Now I just say, whatever.

I hope everyone enjoys whatever they decide to do.

I'm outta here.

Oh come on Chris, if anything you are the victim here. Don't get all upset.
Your truck looks Killer, The color is amazing, original, and the rear bed looks so Great.

Someone at RPG has been on the keyboard WAY too much and I have quit my anger management classes so Yup I'm standing on top of the clock tower ****** with the wind.

---------- Post added at 02:57 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:52 AM ----------

LOL.. Damm me for trying to help make sense of things!


I'm pretty sure that I brought up a few different things that could make for some interesting discussion. For those that feel like it was me starting shit so be it.. For others, there is plenty to discuss.

It's more of a Vendor vs Vendor vs Vendor than personal attacks.

Did you see the video of that ? class 1 car catch on fire ? Damn thing freeking was a instant inferno. Dudes are lucky to be alive. The video from the other pit show how scary it was. Dude on skip loader was a brave M. Fer

---------- Post added at 03:17 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:57 AM ----------

What's the matter 6.2 ? nobody posting in your thread ?
everyone leave town ? Ya snowed in ? Yo eh, ya hooser ?

---------- Post added at 03:26 AM ---------- Previous post was at 03:17 AM ----------

Ok, I volunteer my truck to test all LT kits our vendors offer. I know it will be a sacrifice on my part, but to clear the air I feel it needs to be done.
:

You actually have a Great point going on.

Put up or shut up !

a vendors run what ya brung, show up and show us your product. 3 or 4 different trucks, with different versions of long travel and standard travel upgrades. Run on the same track, video, personal testomonys of un biased individuals (like that would happen here).
We have money to spend.
WE DO NOT HAVE MONEY TO WASTE ON PRODUCTS WE HAVE TO TAKE BACK OFF OUR TRUCKS AND THEN PAY AGAIN FOR QUALITY AND DEPENDABLE PRODUCTS THAT ARE TESTED AND PROVEN !

---------- Post added at 03:34 AM ---------- Previous post was at 03:26 AM ----------

So Birdman, what you are saying is that FRF members should just buy crappy products (****cough**** recon ***cough***) and not inform other members of the lack of customer service, crappy performance, lack of quality, etc.. And have the vendors (who actually care) be able to take feedback and improve their products?

Or FRF members provide real world feed back of products, mods, etc to keep other members from wasting their money on magic paint, negative offset wheels, recon headlights?

Greg

FRF has turned into what the originators were banned from. All about the money $ $ $ Vendors paying, ad money $ $ $, free products from ass kissing vendors $ $ $ Ya know that free capitolist society we live in.

 

[Aaron]

This could have been informative, but instead it's just dumb.

I'd love to see a comparison of the four kits (Outlaw, SDHQ, Brenthel, RPG) with some civil discussion and all the vendors participating. This is a fiasco.

BigScott, you're just fueling the fire here...

 

[BigScott]

So a big factor that no one is considering when talking long travel is the added stress it causes on a frame. The faster you can go Offroad, the harder the hits, the more vibration. It all takes a toll. A full cage really needs to be considered when increasing travel numbers like that. I'm not talking about a cab cage either. In talking front to back. Completely tied together. Also you get the added benefit of protecting the occupants.

Check out the rough riders special Olympics truck Foutz built to get a better idea of what I am talking about.

Trey you bring up an EXCELLENT point. Even a stock Raptor is capable of speeds that would require a roll cage, and not just some bolt in "B" pillar thing to fasten your seat belts to. I am talking 6 point cage like Raptizzles, or what Ricks (SPRSNKS) truck had when we rolled, or what Conner from Outlaw Raptor had when he rolled.
It's called Triangulation. I went with a guy in Las Vegas to a building where the Nye Frank built Rob Mac driven truck was sometime late 1990's, I wish I had pictures. It is all about the structure supporting the front. The front takes the most punishment, even trophy trucks front ends nearly break off due to the speed and forces applied to the front tires. Going 80 to 140 miles per hour on hard rough desert is more than a non caged truck should be able to handle.
Sorry Chris you should not run as fast as SPRSNK in a fully caged Raptor or your truck could have seroius frame damage.
Long travel soaks up more of the bumps but those shocks have to disperse that energy up, if no added support structure is there the frame is the only thing there. Also keep in mind it is a multi peice frame that is welded together in front of the cab and rear of the cab. Also keep in mind that the stock frame is designed to collapse in an impact crash. Seeing how the RPG trucks frame folded up like a taco shell when Jarret wrapped it around a pole at 60 + mph I have little faith the stock frame will take an extended amount of abuse that someone like SPRSNK could dish out Without a full front to rear cage.

Excellent point we all missed, Trey you get extra rep points.

What was this original thread about ? ? all the O P wanted was to know if Ricks Lt was from H n M or B M S or something like that. I bet he wont open another can of worms like that. Sorry bro, pop in and keep us on track on this crazy thread.

 

[BigScott]

This could have been informative, but instead it's just dumb.

I'd love to see a comparison of the four kits (Outlaw, SDHQ, Brenthel, RPG) with some civil discussion and all the vendors participating. This is a fiasco.

BigScott, you're just fueling the fire here...

Yes Arron I agree on a head to head to head comparision of products.

Oh Arron I know you are all RPG, I was too. I spent quite a bit more than you and I now have to decide if I just take that stuff off and sell it for whatever I can get for it or what I should do. I do have an issue with Jarret that I had a lengthy conversation with Corey about. Since Corey seemed to not have a problem with it I still do. So as far as going directly to that person and having an adult conversation and trying to bring resolve to a situation, I did that.
I spent well over a year now looking into Raptor products, I felt RPG made at the time what I felt was the quality product. I have continued my research on Raptor products and what holds up on Raptor Expeditions, the Raptor Product proving grounds in my opinion. I asked Jarret 2 or 3 times, Hey come out on the Land Rush run and show all your products hold up without failures and put the back and forth arguements to rest. Oh no, Jarrett is way too busy. But now Jarrett can dive almost 2000 miles to the Snowball, MI. thing......Ok

A guy pointed out a very valid fact about the RPG frame support/bump stop kit. In a rear end collision the crumple zone is now "C" channel encapsulated so that on the drivers side the only place for the frame to go is into the gas tank, or push the gas tank into the driveshaft causing it to rupture and catch fire. Another possibility is the frame will be so stiff that a car goes under the rear and since the frame cannot bend down like Ford designed it a driver/passenger is possibly decapated ? Where does RPG stand on this ? Their products are for off road purposes only ! Where are you ? in a law suit screwed. Most do not think like I do, I am constantly looking and thinking about this issue and where the safest fix is going to be. Are we to shut our mouths and drink the RPG cool aid and see if this happens ? I hope we do not have any personal injurys to any of our Raptor community members.
I also feel the current direction RPG has decided to take with bolt on products is a dangerous one. I understand Why Corey chooses to go this way, but I do not agree. For 65% to 80% of the purchasers of RPG products there will be no problems since their usage will mostly be street or mild off road use. But what happens when some of those increase their off road interest or dirving skill level ?

So there you have some of it, put a petition together and have me banned so your RPG buddys can go on without anyone questioning anything they do. Would that make some of you happy ? Sure seems like ol Jarrett sent out PM's to his buddys to come help, Big Scott is bullying me in this thread. No I just got tired of Jarretts keyboard rattling way too hard. I do not spend time on here to build rep points or kiss rear ends. I express how I see it, especially after I have done the investigating. If you do not like what I have to express ? ? Sorry I will not conform to please the masses.