Cam Phaser/Engine Failure Reports

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FordTechOne

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Definitely record it, and take to the dealer so that they note it. This is something that will get louder with time and then it gets to the point of failure.

Wrong. Stop giving out bad information.

If it fails, things go all out of time and then bad things happen. Get it handled soon.

"Bad things happen"? You prove with every additional post that you're a know nothing troll. The engine doesn't "go out of time"; this issue is related to the camshafts parking properly. There is not a single report of piston to valve contact due to faulty phasers.

Be advised that the people with parts post-April still have the same issue. Even with the various part number changes, Ford still has not fixed this. The Q4 TSB with the yet-again revised parts never happened. So, ford is still building engines that will still have cam phaser failures.

More false information and hearsay. Where are these people you speak for? They don't exist, because you make things up as you go. There was NEVER any statement in the SSM stating that new or revised part numbers were being released. I addressed this with you last time by posting the SSM again and you continue to spread the same false information.
 
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FordTechOne

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Cam phaser part number changes... Are you living under a rock? The gen 1 engine ecoboost had several different part numbers for the cam phasers. That same concept morphed into the gen 2 engine ecoboost. Again, they have changed numbers for the phasers at least twice now, and Ford said a third new number would be released Q4 2019. I am kind of surprised that you actually have no idea about any of this. You might want to go do some research a bit more before you com here guns ablazin.

Show us these GEN 1 part number changes you're referring to. We'll wait.

The GEN 2 are a completely different design than the GEN 1. They share no part numbers in common. There is no "issue that morphed into the GEN 2 engine". You fabricated that theory entirely.

Once again...Ford NEVER stated that a part number change was coming in the TSB. You assumed that and have been spreading that false information in every post you can. Give it up already.
 
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My build date is 9/21/17
No mods, 62,000 miles
Brought truck in for noticeable lack of power, rattle on start up & constant tick
1’st dealer said if something was wrong with truck computer would be showing codes
I did not agree so I opened a case with Ford, they told me to bring it to another dealer
2’nd dealer agreed something was wrong. They agreed to change valve covers and change cam phasers. They did valve cover update, phasers were on back order so they had me drive truck while waiting for phasers. The night I picked truck up it ran unbelievable, like it has never run since day 1, that was a Thursday, truck ran like that till Sunday and went back to no power, dealer had no explanation, 2 aweeks later they replaced phasers this eliminated start up rattle, tick and power issues were the same. Dealer told Ford my truck was repaired and 100% Ford called me and I explained what was going on and agreed that I should do some research and find a dealer that has more experience with specialty vehicles.
3’rd dealer went for a ride and listened to tick and told me engine needs to be replaced. It took dealer about three weeks to get engine replacement approved.engine was on back order, engine arrived to dealer 12-18-19, it is supposed to be done any day now. I hope it will finally run like a Raptor should.
MY ADVICE WOULD BE, IF YOURE HAVING ISSUES OPEN A CASE.
 

FordTechOne

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My build date is 9/21/17
No mods, 62,000 miles
Brought truck in for noticeable lack of power, rattle on start up & constant tick
1’st dealer said if something was wrong with truck computer would be showing codes
I did not agree so I opened a case with Ford, they told me to bring it to another dealer
2’nd dealer agreed something was wrong. They agreed to change valve covers and change cam phasers. They did valve cover update, phasers were on back order so they had me drive truck while waiting for phasers. The night I picked truck up it ran unbelievable, like it has never run since day 1, that was a Thursday, truck ran like that till Sunday and went back to no power, dealer had no explanation, 2 aweeks later they replaced phasers this eliminated start up rattle, tick and power issues were the same. Dealer told Ford my truck was repaired and 100% Ford called me and I explained what was going on and agreed that I should do some research and find a dealer that has more experience with specialty vehicles.
3’rd dealer went for a ride and listened to tick and told me engine needs to be replaced. It took dealer about three weeks to get engine replacement approved.engine was on back order, engine arrived to dealer 12-18-19, it is supposed to be done any day now. I hope it will finally run like a Raptor should.
MY ADVICE WOULD BE, IF YOURE HAVING ISSUES OPEN A CASE.

I can't disagree with that. If you're not getting any satisfaction from your dealer (which are ALL franchised unfortunately, not corporate) the best course of action is to open a case with Ford. When dealers know that corporate is involved, they are more likely to contact the hotline, prioritize your vehicle, provide a loaner, and get it dispatched to the right technician to be fixed properly.

How did they determine that the engine needed to be replaced?
 
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The tech listened to tick. I think he said it was coming from bank 3, then said it was gonna need to be replaced. Had to send pics of scoring inside cylinders to Ford. I don’t know a lot about vehicles so I didn’t pay very close attention. I will share what paperwork says when I get it back..
 

FordTechOne

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The tech listened to tick. I think he said it was coming from bank 3, then said it was gonna need to be replaced. Had to send pics of scoring inside cylinders to Ford. I don’t know a lot about vehicles so I didn’t pay very close attention. I will share what paperwork says when I get it back..

These engines have 2 banks; no engine has 3 banks. Scoring in the cylinder walls is due to a manufacturing defect (low mileage) or a lack of lubrication. Please post the repair information from the dealer when available.
 
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Yes sir! Actually almost 2 hours from me. Best decision I’ve made regarding vehicles. This dealer/service center is top notch and very deserving of the high accolades.

Truck: 2017 802a. 39k miles. 6/17 build date.

First start: absolutely amazing. Quiet.
First drive: Holy crap - the truck hasn’t driven this well since I drove it off the lot! Felt like a brand new truck. I previously had drivability issues (felt like timing was off, truck would stutter, rough idle, absolutely terrible under throttle/boost. On top of this, the transmission was honestly shit (rough, clunked, indecisive on gear selection, hesitant to downshift under throttle modulation, etc.) when I say it felt brand new, I’m not exaggerating. None of these issues were prevalent. The tech said he reflashed my truck to the newest PCM tune (effectively wiping my Cobb stage 1), however I believe the Cobb TCM tune is still installed. I plan to drive it around for a few weeks as it is and monitor everything. When I get bored of the power I’ll reflash the stage 1.

total cost: $0 (to me). Almost $4k to ford

That's awesome! So they didn't give you grief about your Cobb tune? LOL not every dealership would be that cool. I normally go to Bozard to buy parts and have seen a ton of Roush and Shelby Raptors there throughout the years.

Right, and I think @FordTechOne put it rather well in a previous post, and I’m paraphrasing here but, the failure to properly park, and subsequent rattle on cold soak start up -is- resolved by the SSM. That’s not the fix to every single problem.

Numbers are numbers and even Bernie Bro math won’t make them irrelevant. You can obsess over cam phasers or drive the truck and live life.

I’m going to be in for service on the moon roof soon. Again. Statistically, very few folks with the moon roof have the broken tracks. I suppose I’m an overachiever. The concerning thing for me about that issue is that I don’t think the current track is broken, but the dealer will probably pull them and replace rather than try to adjust and calm the rattle. I may need to go to another dealer to facilitate a proper repair.

Things happen. Just because they happen to us respectively doesn’t mean the sky is falling in on ever other Raptor owner.

I am not obsessing over the issue. And I am not saying the sky is falling on every Raptor owner. But to simply disregard the issue because it only effects a small percentage of owners isn't the proper sentiment either.

Sorry to hear about your moonroof. I just watched Sterling West's Moonroof video and ordered the lubricant he recommended. Once it stops raining, I will add it and clean my moonroof! Hope you get a quick fix.

Here is the video for those that are interested:
 

WraptorBoy

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Not sure how else I can explain this...there is no "beginning" cam phaser noise. The phasers either fail to lock and make a loud rattle noise (duration of noise varies), or they lock properly and exhibit no noise. Based on your video, it is not possible that the noise you are hearing is the result of the cam phasers failing to park in their locked position.

As far as the noise you are experiencing, what oil and filter are you running? A missing (cheap filter) or faulty anti-drainback valve within the filter housing will result in a lack of oil pressure to the top end of the engine at cold start. This causes a momentary tapping/knocking noise until the cylinder heads (OHC) or lifters (OHV) receive full oil pressure.

Did you ever observe the wastegate movement on a cold start to see if it coincides with the noise you hear?


FYI, you don't have to explain it (again). I understand the particular "cam phaser parking failure" you are talking about is binary: either working or busted. As I have mentioned earlier I am hoping my "sound" is normal and won't worry about it unless it gets worse. What is worse? Louder. What will cause it to get louder? No idea. Does it matter? Only that I will have a louder noise and will deal with it then.

I also said that no one has posted a sound of their engine in a video in which they believe they do not have the issue. So when someone says "I don't have the issue" for all I know, their engine sounds exactly like mine. To me, it makes perfect sense that in the morning, the oil has drained out of the phasers and, at startup, will rattle until they are filled with oil and builds the appropriate pressure to function. If this isn't correct, no biggie.

I am running stock/original oil and filter and I'm not planning on upgrading to anything outside of stock. I have 2500 miles on the truck. When I go to change the oil, I'll either have the Ford dealer I bought it from do it or I'll buy the oil and filter, based on the manual, from Ford and do the job myself. I don't buy into the whole oil argument.

I did listen for my "sound" from the front wheel well. It's definitely coming from the front of the engine and not the wastegates.

You and others have heard the video. Two or three people chimed in and stated they hear the "rattle" for a second (though very quiet/scaled down) at startup. So clearly, it's there. Let me ask you directly: can you tell me what that brief 1 second "rattle" is when the engine starts? What engine part would create that sound? If you don't know or can't really be sure, that is fine. TIA.

Again, thanks for the help. Like others have mentioned, you're info is desired and appreciated!


normally...i garage park, so i do here sounds because it is so close to the wall and that tends to make it sound loud.

This is over Christmas parking outside and a 30 degree start up. Oil is fresh, less then 2k miles and at proper level.


@goblues38 Thanks for posting this! I have to say my sound is fairly louder and more obvious than yours but I do hear a faint rattle for 1/2 to 1 second at startup in your video.

Now before people get all dismissive and egotistical READ: I am not saying he has an issue. I'm not saying he will develop an issue. I'm not saying his sound is the same as the failure. I'm not saying his is the same as mine. GOT IT? :emotions122: :signs8:

Just kidding. Info and discussion is good. Better than silence.
 
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