Raptor motor vs Ford GT motor

[Caveguru]

I'm reveling in the irony here. Coming from serious tuning of Subarus it's interesting to see everyone go through the same learning curve. For example, the WRX and STI used to share the same block, the EJ25, that was used in the cheapest non-turbo Imprezas and Outbacks, and the forged and nitrided crank was the same on the WRX and the STI (and cost just a couple hundred dollars as a part), and yet with just case bolts you could push that stock block to over 500 crank hp. People think the manufacturers won't put more power in their cars because they can't, but a lot of times the limits are found in certain parts or discrete weaknesses. For example the stock STI pistons are a real weak point. Swap those out (along with case bolts and a few other "cheap" parts) and you got to over 650 crank hp before the block case itself would start to twist and separate and the heads would deflect and you had to start worrying about leaks there too.

What I'm disappointed about is that I would have thought there would be a lot more experience with this ecoboost engine given it's been around in different forms for over 10 years and is in everything from 35k work trucks to 250k supercars. The tuner market for Subarus and others is huge but apparently not well represented with Raptors. Personally I'd love to turn mine into a desert racer but that will have to wait. I guess they are just too expensive and people aren't building 800 hp work trucks.

I will add that I found this builder that claims the stock crank is good for at least up to 700 whp so clearly the problem is not the crank. I also notice that the block is an "open deck" block so there's plenty of space for coolant flow around the cylinders, which makes me wonder about the guys reporting high cylinder temps as a tuning problem down at ~500 whp. I have to think the problem is elsewhere- sufficient total coolant flow, undersized stock radiator, insufficient or badly placed coolant channels in the heads, who knows?
https://www.rmbmotorworks.com/product-page/rmb-motor-works-stage-1-gen-2-short-block

 

[Caveguru]

It’ll be like what it is tuned just faster but there are guys running around w/ GT level power & then some already on this forum- most got hardcore tune + E85/**** conversion & most also have upgraded turbos, seems like some have punched out the block

bottom line is- the Raptor weighs 5700 lbs & it starts & stops there, physics is physics, but I’ll never ask anyone WHY they need more power- quite the contrary, I’m all for it for the most part lol!!

there's a great reason for more power and it's one word - Baja

 

[David Godbee]

Thanks badgertits and FordTech One. I knew I had read the article about the crank. All one has to do is ask google about EcoBoost development and lots of articles about shared parts with the Raptor/Ford GT. Thanks for chiming in with the answers. This forum is the BEST!

 

[Muchmore]

and a lowered compression ratio of 9:1 to support increased boost from the larger turbos.

Out of curiosity how is the compression lowered? Piston or crank?

 

[Caveguru]

Out of curiosity how is the compression lowered? Piston or crank?

if the stroke is the same between the two setups then it's usually in the shape of the piston.

 

[zombiekiller]

there's a great reason for more power and it's one word - Baja

I have never seen fuel over "91" and certainly have not seen any e85 in baja. Due to necessity, I've even bought gasoline out of a jerry can in remote towns with no gas station.

Going fast in the dirt isn't about how much horsepower that you make, it's about how much speed you can carry.

 

[David Godbee]

Heres another good article about how much the engines are alike. Go to Auto Guide.com and check out the article "The new Ford GT shares 70% of engine with the F150. This is per Dave Pericak, head of Ford Performance Division. Just saying!

 

[Fordraptorrrrrrrr]

The issue is that they mark up the parts to discourage installing them on non-GT vehicles. For example, the retail price of the intake manifold is $5338 and the camshafts are $2619 each.

Golly! Guess aftermarket it is lolol

 

[Caveguru]

I have never seen fuel over "91" and certainly have not seen any e85 in baja. Due to necessity, I've even bought gasoline out of a jerry can in remote towns with no gas station.

Going fast in the dirt isn't about how much horsepower that you make, it's about how much speed you can carry.

Of course you are right - I was just joking, except that if you're just practicing or playing around or doing any of the desert races in the sw US, then you would be able to get E85 because there are places that sell it there (although would you really use a Raptor unless you were the one team that's actually fielded it in the stock class?), and if for some crazy reason you're pre-running Baja as part of a team effort you could have enough support to have your own fuel truck although I assume that's uncommon. fwiw, I hope we see this engine soon in a Bronco Raptor so tuning the engine may become more popular and more justified in the field of amateur offroad racing.

 

[zombiekiller]

Of course you are right - I was just joking, except that if you're just practicing or playing around or doing any of the desert races in the sw US, then you would be able to get E85 because there are places that sell it there (although would you really use a Raptor unless you were the one team that's actually fielded it in the stock class?), and if for some crazy reason you're pre-running Baja as part of a team effort you could have enough support to have your own fuel truck although I assume that's uncommon. fwiw, I hope we see this engine soon in a Bronco Raptor so tuning the engine may become more popular and more justified in the field of amateur offroad racing.

any of the race team fueling trucks that I've ever seen are full of c16, not e85.

If I were to race a raptor in the stock class, I'd want to use 260GTX instead... it smells better