You never know when it's your time.

[Donovan]

Details to follow after therapy

View attachment 389443View attachment 389444View attachment 389445View attachment 389446

Thank you SIR!

 

[John M BUNMAN]

Ok, back from the torture chamber…errrrr..therapy.

Where do I start?
First, my deepest sympathies and prayers for the families involved in this tragedy. How will the children/wife be able to recover from the devastating loss of their father and husband. How about the family friend that came to help?
The emotional and mental damage inflicted by this tragedy is immeasurable

If I appear to wander or ramble…it’s because I am wandering and rambling. I have to write it down as it pops into my head or that thought my be gone forever

My thoughts on the tragedy and or other’s ideas on Rescue/Recovery are not intended as criticism. They are simply my thoughts on the subject based upon my limited knowledge and life’s experiences. Someone else may know a better way to do it with different equipment.
ONE COMMON FACTOR IS….THERE IS NO COMMON FACTOR!!
Each Rescue/Recovery is DIFFERENT, although they may appear the same, they are not. The dynamics and equipment needed/involved for each R/R can/ will change, EVEN DURING THE R/R.
THERE IS NO “ONE WAY IS RIGHT,” BUT THERE WILL ALWAYS BE A SAFER OR SAFEST WAY TO ACCOMPLISH THE R/R WITH THE AVAILABLE EQUIPMENT.

I will start by saying this easily could have been me 30+ years ago when I first discovered my love of the trails. We all draw from our life’s experiences and what we have been exposed to throughout our lives. If your family outdoor adventure was a Trip to Bucks that had some Beautiful Trees in the drive through vs the kids raised on a farm or spent a lot of time in the outdoors. Experience matters and more importantly, what you were able to gain from those experiences, both good and bad. The first time I stuck my foot in the Spinning Auger of our snowblower, chewing up my boot and cutting my foot….I learned that I shouldn’t be so mfing lazy when clearing the chute and shut the auger off first

It could have been me….When I first began to hit the Trails on a regular basis, I carried a $39 Air compressor that plugged into the cigarette lighter, barley reached each tire and overheated after filling up 5psi. I had my equally impressive $40 K-mart “Tow-Strap” and that was about it! I don’t remember if I even carried D-Rings, so I’m not sure how the Fuxk I was going to connect my “Strap” to anything??
** Teaching Point** I sometimes see folks on FRF asking a legitimate question and get RAILED because they are a lesser human being than the EXPERTS, who Know All but share not a Mfing thing but their sarcasm and belittling of the FRF member that has a genuine interest in learning how to do something the best/safest way possible. A FNG, like I was. Buys a Raptor and wants to take his family out to Explore our Amazing Country, maybe he saw some videos or pictures and thought m wow, I would love to take my family there to experience that instead of Bucks and the Mall. Then he realizes it may be a daunting task. I don’t know how to Navigate and I have no idea what I may need on the Trail to have the most enjoyable and safest Adventure possible. So they turn to FRF to get some ideas. I forgot where i was going with this…but if you have some thoughts, ideas or experiences that may help someone else, please share them. Along with the 2 links I attached above, the information may help another member from making some of our same mistakes and give them the knowledge and confidence to
HIT THE TRAIL….

MY AAR OF THE TRAGEDY..
1. The first mistake was trying to use a Strap as a KE Recovery Rope. Again, I’ve done the same thing before I knew, what I didn’t know.
NEVER USE A STRAP TO “YANK/SNATCH” a Stuck vehicle. Can you? Yes, Have I, Yes, SHOULD YOU? Absolutely Not….Why? It’s not the safest method.
There is a HUGE DIFFERENCE between Dragging a vehicle and Snatching a vehicle.
I came across a 70’s LR high centered on a large rock in the Trail. 3-options, snatch it-(not needed, to dynamic, likely resulting in more damage) #2 Jack it up, push off the obstacle- (this would have worked, but he had 6” bottle Jack and I didn’t have my Pro-Eagle at that time) #3 Drag it off using Tow-Strap - (This was the safest option, with the likely hood of the least amount of resulting damage)
I used option #3. Note: in “most” situations, the path of least resistance and lowest probability of damage, is to pull the vehicle off the obstacle, back the same way it got onto the obstacle. Also, it is always safer to use your Raptors Rear-End to pull with in Drive, vs using your front end and pulling in reverse. I don’t know shixt about our transmissions, but I was told by a more knowledgeable person that any transmission, is not designed to be loaded with force as applied to a Recovery situation. I had to pull in reverse in this situation however because he was blocking the trail and I couldn’t turn around Luckily it didn’t require any force. Once I had him strapped up, I basically idled in reverse to remove him.
#2 As stated above, that drop hitch is Not a Recovery Point, but if you didn’t have the KSA to know what you didn’t know…then it looks like it would work….
EXCEPT, that’s a heavy Azzszzz vehicle, REALLY S U C KED into the mud. It’s going to take a lot of Force/Energy to Snatch him out.
COMPARISON- I came across an elderly couple who had driven into a Runaway Truck Ramp in their Toyota Celica and buried themselves to the frame in the pea-gravel.
I dug the front tires, bumper and under carriage out. Shoved the MaxTrax under the front tires, attached my TOW-STRAP to them using the J-Hooks that I carry..
(Buttttt, Bunnny, why didn’t you use your KE ROPE, you just got done telling us NEVER USE a TOW-STRAP as a KE Recovery Tool??? Bun is talking out of both sides of his mouth!! I knew he was a POSER, Full of Shixt, always posting pictures of Raptors on the Trail, that he found on the internet!! Bun Really Drives a MFING PRIUS!?!!) You would be correct in all of your above assessments….except the Celica is a relatively light vehicle compared to the Raptor. The Celica was buried in loose pea-gravel vs sand or Suxcking GA mud. It would require MINIMAL Force/Energy to remove them. As it worked out, I took out the slack in the Strap, barely applied the throttle and it popped right up on the pea-gravel, because of the MaxTrax and scooted right over to the hardball rd. I of course asked only one thing of “Pops”, not money, not thanks..Just please don’t DRIVE ON MY STRAP! And of course the Mfer drove on my Strap

I am getting long winded and I have to change ice on my knee
So I will continue rambling below..

 

[Nex]

Long live the ramblings of old man bunman!

 

[Keshka]

What reading pointed to that I think would really help. Some sort of damping on the tow strap/rope/cable. A chain over the center would slow it down but may not be the best choice. Logic also says two dampers, one at each third of the strap so it could not double back on it's self. I also have been using soft cleats of late but I need better ones.

 

[John M BUNMAN]

What reading pointed to that I think would really help. Some sort of damping on the tow strap/rope/cable. A chain over the center would slow it down but may not be the best choice. Logic also says two dampers, one at each third of the strap so it could not double back on it's self. I also have been using soft cleats of late but I need better ones.

Always a great idea using the dampeners like you said above.
Warn, ARB and many others make several versions of dampeners. Some are weighted/ filled “Saddle bags“ that you hang over the Strap/Rope. Some are empty bags that you fill on the trail with available rocks/sand. Anything is better than nothing. A few heavy jackets, blankets, etc…anything that will aid in dropping the Rescue/Recovery System to the ground in case of failure.
Soft Shackles are the bomb and have become all the Rage!
Not only are they safer, they are much easier to use. You can easily wrap them around your friends Fake Off-Roading Dodge, that lacks any real/ traditional Recovery Points, using whatever you can attach it to, without disassembling it
No Offense of course

 

[thatJeepguy]

damn... I get nervous just using the winch on my atv that the hook might come flying back, maybe time to look into some alternatives

I always drape/ Throw a jacket or blanket over the line at the attachment or just offset. This will deaden the kinetic rebound in the event of a snap a fair amount.

 

[xxxMannimalxxx]

I always drape/ Throw a jacket or blanket over the line at the attachment or just offset. This will deaden the kinetic rebound in the event of a snap a fair amount.

That must be a pretty big jacket! ;-)

Jokes aside, I appreciated every bit of @John M BUNMAN s comments/advice/rambling.

 

[thatJeepguy]

That must be a pretty big jacket! ;-)

Jokes aside, I appreciated every bit of @John M BUNMAN s comments/advice/rambling.

Yea hes got great experience and is humble. On the trail you have to know when to hold and when to fold and bypass based on your rig and driver capability. If possible working with angles and peel/snatch with a block are good techniques you redirect forces away from you and improve leverage as well as picking the line of least resistance. The best recovery is not always head on. But space will dictate.

 

[smurfslayer]

FRF Bunnery Sergeant John said:

** Teaching Point** I sometimes see folks on FRF asking a legitimate question and get RAILED because they are a lesser human being than the EXPERTS, who Know All but share not a Mfing thing but their sarcasm and belittling of the FRF member that has a genuine interest in learning how to do something the best/safest way possible. A FNG, like I was. Buys a Raptor and wants to take his family out to Explore our Amazing Country, maybe he saw some videos or pictures and thought m wow, I would love to take my family there to experience that instead of Bucks and the Mall. Then he realizes it may be a daunting task. I don’t know how to Navigate and I have no idea what I may need on the Trail to have the most enjoyable and safest Adventure possible. So they turn to FRF to get some ideas. I forgot where i was going with this…but if you have some thoughts, ideas or experiences that may help someone else, please share them. Along with the 2 links I attached above, the information may help another member from making some of our same mistakes and give them the knowledge and confidence to
HIT THE TRAIL….

Yup. Exactly right. The very LAST thing we want is a n00b, rookie, lesser experienced new owner to be discouraged from ASKING.

Thanks Bunny!

 

[tabvette]

So wait, are we calling him Bunny now? I can't keep up.