Order Placed --> then this happened.

[Specialtyperformanceparts]

Ever notice how dealerships love to mislead you by giving you the impression that there is this adversarial relationship with shotty communication between salesman and GM, then GM and Ford. Saleman was told he could sell at MSRP, but GM is the bad guy who changed his mind. Or Ford told them wrong. Always giving you the impression that your sales guy is on your side, but he can't do it for you. I'm sure the sale guy is making plenty of commission off the ADM part of the sale.

Not always. In many cases, just like the “ADM” for the public. Many GM’s/Owners put what’s called a “Pack” on the profit or margin so they don’t have to pay their sales guys their full percentage. So for example. Let’s say there is $5k from invoice to sticker. There is also another $1800 holdback. The dealers typically don’t pay any percentage of the holdback to the salespeople, and it is to pay for floor plan in a bucket for all vehicles on their lot anyway, so it has a purpose at least. It’s to stock vehicles. Some make money, some lose depending on how long vehicles sit on lots. Out of the $5k that’s left, they generally have a “pack” of say 2-1/2% to 3% of the invoice price which is essentially $2500. Which means if a sales guy gets paid 20%. They only get 20% of $2500. So that’s $500.

The dealers that do the big ADM’s generally don’t pay anything on them to sales people and call it a “market adjustment pack”
In that situation they may either not pay at all on the ADM or just pay $1000 flat and no percentage altogether.
So the sales guys don’t make out typically in these situations either. Unfortunately.
The mentality here is that the sales guys aren’t selling anything. They are just order takers, and therefore don’t deserve their full cut. In some cases, this might be true. In others, the sales guys do a good job bringing the customers in that place the orders.

Now, a side note to think about is the middle ground. I always try to look at all sides and I am very familiar with the auto industry. There are certainly other bad players out there, not just dealers. I am not saying it is right or wrong for a dealer to have an ADM. I am just explaining both sides.
That being said, look at the PS5 and the XBOX Series X, and Graphics cards for that matter for just one example. All these BOTS are buying them up and flipping them at 50-100% markup on Ebay, Amazon, and StockX. The REAL consumers never get a chance to buy them direct. Rarely. When the supply/demand is so far off like this... those investors come out of the wood work. Of course they also create some of the shortage. They are doing it on houses too. So the real consumers don't even get a chance to get one at a fair price. So, one question is, is it fair for the dealer to get the ADM? or a Reseller? It's just a question. These things will be at auctions soon from the bad players the infiltrate dealers that sell at MSRP, only to resell them at auction. This will happen with these trucks as well as it does with other stuff. So guys if you want one at MSRP and find a dealer, buy them as much as possible so the resellers don't get the chance!
I think it would probably be MORE FAIR for dealers to verify intent before selling to just anyone and then sell at MSRP? But how do you do that? There are a lot of sides here. I agree, good deserving consumers should be able to buy at MSRP from a dealer.... but there are a lot of arguments as to how to control the market. I also think if a dealer charges a markup, the sales guys should be paid in accordance. If they don't, then they should vet buyers to minimize resellers. Those of you who have relationships with dealers and bought before are already vetted and should NEVER have been told "Sorry, we changed our minds."

There is also another evil force working in the background that should be brought to light... and these guys should be SHUT DOWN! They are called "Vehicle Locator Services". What they are essentially is a broker, but they don't need a license because they don't actually SELL anything!! They just set it up! They have the dealers wire this and that between themselves. It's a scam in a sense. They call dealer A and say... "I see you have a Raptor in stock. I have Dealer B and C who are willing to take it off your hands for $15,000 over sticker. All you need to do is take 10 F-150 XLT's at invoice from them."

What they do here, is the manipulate numbers. They talk to dealer B and C and get them to sell their 10 F-150's for $2000 under invoice.... 10 x $2,000 is $20,000 right?
Then they tell the dealer getting rid of the 10 at $2,000 under invoice that they have a Raptor for them on trade for those at MSRP... Do you see where this is going? So they gain $20,000.... they tell the dealer A they got them $15k over MSRP. That leaves them $5k for doing NOTHING!! they manipulate and play with numbers and scam the dealers for profit.... This is similar to when a dealer plays with them numbers between a trade in and new vehicle sale price.
Why is that important to you? How does it relate to this situation?
Like this.... When the dealer sees he is getting $15k over sticker for a Raptor (Which he isn't). He thinks... "OH.... If I got $15K over from a dealer, what is he selling it for? I better sell my next one on the lot for $20k over!!!"

This causes the same sort of issues you are having here. It's a reactive business. If dealer A charges over, dealer B sees it and also does. If Dealer A marks something to invoice, so does dealer B.

So below is an example of a real transfer sheet from one of them. Being a business, I can't post the name.

 

[WannabeRaptor]

I have officially found one dealer outside of DFW area that took my order and guaranteed no ADM, and validated by their GM this morning. I received the Order Verification Form and it states 37 Performance Package in the body style section (again, pay attn to this as some dealers might be allocating you to a 35, so request it in writing) to avoid unnecessary mishaps.

it seems I've ticked all the boxes with this location --> signed the OVF and scanned back. Dealer will get back to me with updates, but anybody here know what should happen next?

 

[GTTXRAP]

Ordered mine today. Dealer had 3 allocation--I got second one and order is in (and confirmed w/ Ford rep). He has no more allocations left (Central TX) I've bought 4 from same dealer (see signature) and deal with GM. MSRP (and it pains me to pay that when I got $8K off my 20 lol). Went with 35 package loaded up. Will get R next year and trade this one back, so didn't see need for 37 (plus hate blue interior). Now the wait begins.

 

[Roger33]

So a friend ordered one from a dealer and the dealer stated that they can't charge the mark up because you are not buying the vehicle from them. The dealer is only the delivery point, hence destination fee and that is all that they can charge you for. If there are any sales people out there, please respond and educate us.

 

[Specialtyperformanceparts]

So a friend ordered one from a dealer and the dealer stated that they can't charge the mark up because you are not buying the vehicle from them. The dealer is only the delivery point, hence destination fee and that is all that they can charge you for. If there are any sales people out there, please respond and educate us.

That was only true on the Ford GT. Other vehicles, the dealer is invoiced for and billed with an invoice. The Ford GT, the customer selected any dealer and ford sent a delivery check essentially to the dealer for a "Service Rendered".
The Bronco, Lightning and Mach E GT is sort of in-between. You can reserve one on Fords website, but they transfer it to the dealer of your choice. Unlike the Ford GT, where you pay Ford. You do pay the dealer and they get an invoice just like any other time, however, you agreed to the retail price essentially when you made the reservation on Ford.com.... So if a dealer tries to mark it up after the fact, there would probably be some pretty big issues. The Raptor unfortunately Ford didn't allow you to reserve online. So it goes back to a traditional dealer purchase.

 

[MurderedOutSVT]

This is the kindler, gentler, snowflake safe raptor forum.

Non-Triggering Safe space

 

[rosh]

I confirmed with a dealer saleswoman 3 times that I was getting a 37, today I was told I am out. I was going to drive 1k miles to pick it up. 2 other dealers told me they had allocations but wouldn't do the deal over the phone. Dealing with Ford salespeople absolutely sucks and maybe this is all for the best. We don't even have confirmed specs on the truck.

Ford has been leaving the dealerships and the salespeople in the dark as well. I am both a buyer and a salesman, so i see what it's like on both ends.

 

[melvimbe]

Not always. In many cases, just like the “ADM” for the public. Many GM’s/Owners put what’s called a “Pack” on the profit or margin so they don’t have to pay their sales guys their full percentage. So for example. Let’s say there is $5k from invoice to sticker. There is also another $1800 holdback. The dealers typically don’t pay any percentage of the holdback to the salespeople, and it is to pay for floor plan in a bucket for all vehicles on their lot anyway, so it has a purpose at least. It’s to stock vehicles. Some make money, some lose depending on how long vehicles sit on lots. Out of the $5k that’s left, they generally have a “pack” of say 2-1/2% to 3% of the invoice price which is essentially $2500. Which means if a sales guy gets paid 20%. They only get 20% of $2500. So that’s $500.

The dealers that do the big ADM’s generally don’t pay anything on them to sales people and call it a “market adjustment pack”
In that situation they may either not pay at all on the ADM or just pay $1000 flat and no percentage altogether.
So the sales guys don’t make out typically in these situations either. Unfortunately.
The mentality here is that the sales guys aren’t selling anything. They are just order takers, and therefore don’t deserve their full cut. In some cases, this might be true. In others, the sales guys do a good job bringing the customers in that place the orders.

Thanks for this feedback. My assumption was that you would want a salesman to be motivated to sell at a higher price, but I suppose that isn't really needed. You only need to sales to do test drives and get him interested, and the GM is deciding the final price. That makes some sense. Perhaps they should get incentive for selling vehicles at a higher price that are in less demand.

Now, a side note to think about is the middle ground. I always try to look at all sides and I am very familiar with the auto industry. There are certainly other bad players out there, not just dealers. I am not saying it is right or wrong for a dealer to have an ADM. I am just explaining both sides.
That being said, look at the PS5 and the XBOX Series X, and Graphics cards for that matter for just one example. All these BOTS are buying them up and flipping them at 50-100% markup on Ebay, Amazon, and StockX. The REAL consumers never get a chance to buy them direct. Rarely. When the supply/demand is so far off like this... those investors come out of the wood work. Of course they also create some of the shortage. They are doing it on houses too. So the real consumers don't even get a chance to get one at a fair price. So, one question is, is it fair for the dealer to get the ADM? or a Reseller? It's just a question. These things will be at auctions soon from the bad players the infiltrate dealers that sell at MSRP, only to resell them at auction. This will happen with these trucks as well as it does with other stuff. So guys if you want one at MSRP and find a dealer, buy them as much as possible so the resellers don't get the chance!

I generally don't like broker's in general. They serve a positive purpose in smoothing out markets during highs and low trends, which is generally good. Buying goods and holding them when demand is low can help a producer maintain a steady reliable income. They also can be helpful in connecting producers to consumers, which is needed work. Dealers provide this function. However, when a product is in high demand, they do nothing but inflate costs without providing any real value to the producer or consumer.

Your point about game consoles is very valid. These are effectively brokers/resellers/scalpers that are taking advantage of high demand and will be gone as soon as that high demand dries up. The only real service they provide is making easy for the wealthy who want to essentially buy their way to the front of the line. You see these guys all over the place in every market and time a product is in demand.

I used to be somewhat of a toy collector when my kids were younger. You would see scalpers try and buy up all the stock when a new toy was released, so they could sell it for a profit on ebay. The worst was if they couldn't sell in 30 days, they would just return back to the original store at no cost to them. It's a big part of the reason why retail stores will blacklist customers who abuse the return policy.

 

[wweaver]

After getting told I would have to pay ADM I dropped my long time dealer. Found a 37 inch allocation - Got lucky their other two raptor allocations were ordered w 35s - after spending a day on the phone more or less. I can say this, with some exceptions of course....If you want a 21 with 37s at msrp you probably have until the end Of the week and that’s it.

 

[Pikser]

I have officially found one dealer outside of DFW area that took my order and guaranteed no ADM, and validated by their GM this morning. I received the Order Verification Form and it states 37 Performance Package in the body style section (again, pay attn to this as some dealers might be allocating you to a 35, so request it in writing) to avoid unnecessary mishaps.

it seems I've ticked all the boxes with this location --> signed the OVF and scanned back. Dealer will get back to me with updates, but anybody here know what should happen next?

Did you pay a deposit ?