Isn’t relocating intercooler in front of radiator an issue?

[Terry]

This photo is of a Chevrolet 2500HD Diesel pickup coolant stack. The small radiator at the bottom is the trans cooler. Front to rear is the air-conditioning condenser, intercooler and radiator. Notice that the intercooler on the 6.6L diesel is huge compared to the one on the Raptor.

 

[nikhsub1]

This photo is of a Chevrolet 2500HD Diesel pickup coolant stack. The small radiator at the bottom is the trans cooler. Front to rear is the air-conditioning condenser, intercooler and radiator. Notice that the intercooler on the 6.6L diesel is huge compared to the one on the Raptor.


View attachment 141672

This is exactly how many ***/Audi cars roll.


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[Badgertits]

This is exactly how many ***/Audi cars roll.


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Yeah well - its certainly gonna be vehicle specific as the way they ingest air & the available placement for a rad/IC is different on every vehicle too. What we KNOW is that there have been Raptor owners who experienced cooling issues w/ this kind of setup in extreme conditions and/or in particularly hot weather states - evidenced by responses in this thread.

You know what else diesel trucks have that most vehicles don't (including raptor to an extent hence this thread) a MASSIVE gaping maw of a grill w/ plenty of air flow & the aero of a flying brick so you know the air is getting pounded directing into the nose.

On other hand - my C5 Z06 - well all C5/C6 vettes really - essentially don't have grills. They're "bottom feeders" - no F'n way would you stack rads like that or you're almost guaranteed to have an issue - heat soak in traffice/extreme conditions is normal in stock vettes. The IC for my blower is positioned at the bottom right/center below the rad & heat exchanger, allowing it to get the "coldest" air coming directly through the front diffuser.

 

[TurboTJ]

Glad to see all the responses and good discussion!

I think the best answer is a half as tall Full Race/Cobb intercooler. It would still allow fresh air to part of the AC condenser, allow for a winch to be mounted, allow fresh air to the transmission cooler and still be 2x as good as the stock IC. This is the route I will be going.

What all of you fail to understand is that air flows through the intercooler. Very well I might add. It isn't 'blocking' anything. The air temp differential from ambient to after the intercooler won't be more than 5 degrees or so. *** cars sandwich the AC/Intercooler/Radiator in that order with the radiator being last. This is from the factory. Now, you may ask yourself why that order? Well, I can theorize as I've owned one and replaced the IC on it as well with a stouter unit. AC condensers get hot, in fact when it is hot and you turn the ac on, you feel the decrease in power as now the IC is getting super heated air.

Secondly, there are aftermarket companies that make aftermarket intercoolers that are relocated to the bottom of the vehicle - removing the IC from in between the AC and radiator. The units are smaller but are a true FMIC. Guess what? They do not perform nearly as well as a good aftermarket IC in the stock sandwiched location.

In order to know why Ford did what they did with the OEM setup we have to understand their goals. IMO the stock IC is the weakest link in the cooling system, bar none. Not only is the unit a pile of shit to begin with but they place it right behind where the license plate is supposed to go. Fans on an IC? That is a first for me, never seen it before. Typically fans are not needed on an IC because when moving, an IC needs to get airflow - almost impossible when you block 80% of the opening to get the air you need.

I know everyone on the internet is a PHD and all that but what I can say is that I have done extensive heat exchange testing - including studying the effects of sandwiching them, the very subject we are discussing here. Anyway, get a blower or a hairdryer and blow it though a radiator or intercooler if you have one laying around, you will see it's almost like nothing is there in terms of affecting the airflow.

Do any of the *** heat exchanger stacks have a tranny cooler second?

I respectfully disagree. Quoting 5 degrees is nonsensical because you aren’t saying under what conditions. The temp rise is based on
1) The mass airflow rate of ambient air through the grill and into the intercooler (which is related to vehicle speed) and how laminar/turbulent it is
2) The ambient air temperature
3) mass flow rate of compressed airflow inside the intercooler
4) the temperature of the compressed air through the intercooler (based on the current adiabatic efficiency of the compressor)

This is all for a specific intercooler so I’ve left of surface area, materials conductivity, pressure drop, etc.

I don’t think diesels are a good comparison because they don’t have to worry about high temperatures causing engine knock. Intercooler on diesels are to recovery air density (and maybe lower EGTs?).

I would also like to point out that trucks, unlike most cars, may see high load (I.e. high intercooler temps) at slow speeds. Since the temp drop of the compressed air and the temp rise of the ambient air is dependent on speed, this is a major consideration.

While I’m not suggesting that you agree with me solely because of it, I do have my masters in Mechanical Engineering and thermodynamics and heat transfer are my specialities.

 

[nikhsub1]

no F'n way would you stack rads like that or you're almost guaranteed to have an issue

I'd tell you you're wrong, but you're clearly thick.

 

[nikhsub1]

Do any of the *** heat exchanger stacks have a tranny cooler second?

No. However, I have seen zero difference in tranny temps from stock IC to relocated IC - I have the temp displayed via ForScan on my cluster.

 

[TurboTJ]

No. However, I have seen zero difference in tranny temps from stock IC to relocated IC - I have the temp displayed via ForScan on my cluster.

interesting. Have you taken it into the dunes or done towing while watching the temp or was this just under normal conditions?

 

[Badgertits]

I'd tell you you're wrong, but you're clearly thick.

You realize you’re quoting a comment in reference to my blown vette, not a raptor right? In that scenario- no I’m not wrong- no F’n grill bud. Only limited spots to gain access to cold air.

whatever- you’re basically arguing sandwiching these cooling condensers is a better option than not, and it makes zero sense

 

[nikhsub1]

interesting. Have you taken it into the dunes or done towing while watching the temp or was this just under normal conditions?

I don't tow so no. Normal conditions so far - it does get rather hot here in the summers though.

You realize you’re quoting a comment in reference to my blown vette, not a raptor right? In that scenario- no I’m not wrong- no F’n grill bud. Only limited spots to gain access to cold air.

whatever- you’re basically arguing sandwiching these cooling condensers is a better option than not, and it makes zero sense

Sorry my bad... and no, I'm not arguing that sandwiching is better than not, all things equal. What I am arguing is a big FMIC in front of the rad and transcooler is FAR more beneficial than having a smaller IC in the OEM location and that the FMIC is much less detrimental to radiator cooling than you think. I have a 170 thermostat in my truck, even in the dead of summer I don't see over 200 degrees, ever. Usually hovers around 185ish.

 

[isis]

If you’re in hot temps all the time then get a tune that takes it into account and runs a little less boost or add a better radiator too.

Otherwise the intercooler isn’t always running a lot of heat so isn’t causing any issues. Nobody’s on full boost all the time in a ton of heat unless you’re towing too much weight up a mountain in Arizona and in that case you probably picked the wrong truck.