DIY stereo upgrade for under $500.00

[K223]

I know there is really no replacement for a nice 10” sub. 8’s will only hit so hard. But if one wanted to preserve the factory enclosure and put in the highest performing 8” driver they could get there hands on. What would fit and what would that be? Anyone do this and have much improvement in sub bass quality? I realize your going to need to add a real sub amp as well.

I would like to enhance or replace my sub first and then go back and work in the rest of the system later. Sorry to say I have gotten used to the sound quality to some extent and reworking the sub is first on my list and then mods and highs.

Will I need to invest in the ZEN processor to accomplish this with the sub? Or is there a simpler way to just add the sub amp? I do realize I would need the Zen anyway to rework the rest of the system. So maybe cry once.

 

[smurfslayer]

I think there are 2 8” possibilities, Pioneer shallow and Kicker shallow. The pioneer is rated to 250, the kicker 300w. I ran the kicker for about a year and even with the Sony amp, yes, it’s a big improvement.

for the ’17’s with the Sony amp, the kicker/stock enclosure is a good upgrade and inexpensive to do. Also, you can do the upgrades to the Sony system in stages, so cry a little, several times. B&O dooms you to a full on upgrade all at once. Sure, you can do speakers first, and hit the forscan mod for aftermarket sub, but to amp it well you need a signal processor. That is a ton more work.

 

[K223]

So with the B&O can I use the Zen in tandem with a new sub amp and maybe another 8” driver? Or no way to interface the Zen without taking it all apart?

I would probably be using a JL 500W amp. I will have to look into those subs. I figured it’s pretty shallow in that factory enclosure.

 

[smurfslayer]

So with the B&O can I use the Zen in tandem with a new sub amp and maybe another 8” driver? Or no way to interface the Zen without taking it all apart?

I would probably be using a JL 500W amp. I will have to look into those subs. I figured it’s pretty shallow in that factory enclosure.

I need to defer on what you need for the 2018. @lawdog, @dhmcfadin, @goblues38 are better positioned to answer what (all) you need to wire in a sub, but I was under the impression that you could not just grab speaker level inputs from the 2018+ B&O to power the sub.

Which takes the sub from a “less than 3 bills” mod, to a 4 digit proposition.

You can see from early posts in this thread, or my “Added a sub” thread for how easy the ’17 Sony sub add was. With either Pioneer or Kicker, you’ll need a torch or heat gun to melt / re-mold the rear of the stock sub enclosure. While you have it out, it’s a good time to wrap the enclosure. I went this route because I need my floor space, so any sub updates I do must go behind the seat. I then eventually spent the extra on a 10” enclosure, amp etc.

 

[goblues38]

@K223 @smurfslayer

To use the ZEN piece....it is all or nothing.

Zen uses the can-bus for the car as an input. You can't split that and have it power the factory B&O and the ZEN. It is one or the other.

The reason why you can't just pull the sub signal off a full range set of speakers like the rear doors is because of the B&O bass management. In order to not have their cheap speakers constantly blow and have warranty claims out the rear, the more you turn up the volume, the less bass signal is passed. So while at listening level 10 on the main screen, you are getting all the bass the factory sub is ever going to give. Move the dial to 20, the factory sub still plays like it did at 10, but now, the rear doors have little to no bass being sent to them.

So, if you pulled the signal off the rear doors, and turned it up to 20. your new aftermarket sub amp, would have little to no input signal for any tones below 100hz, and your subs will have little volume and sound like shit.

that is all well before we ever get into the argument about how high level speaker inputs are just bad, and should never be done. ever.

if you are tight on cash now........buy the zen. buy a 5 channel amp. buy a sub box. keep the factory door speakers.

The B&O amp is the problem. It has too little power, like 12 watts a channel. And the bass management just sucks the life out of all the speakers. When i was building my system. I Did the Zen, the Amp, and the sub box one weekend. Hooked up the factory speakers to my new 600 watt amp, and it was great. Sounded 100x better then the B&O amp. The next weekend i replaced my factory door speakers with my components. but the point is.......to save $600 now, but get you some bass, you can leave the factory doors. they sound fine when you actually give them plenty of power.

People are very uneducated when it comes to speakers. you can almost never have too much power. Too little power is what destroys speakers. you exceed the power of the amp, which causes square waves (distortion) to go to the speaker. Distortion kills speaks.

 

[melvimbe]

So with the B&O can I use the Zen in tandem with a new sub amp and maybe another 8” driver? Or no way to interface the Zen without taking it all apart?

I would probably be using a JL 500W amp. I will have to look into those subs. I figured it’s pretty shallow in that factory enclosure.

Isn't 500W way more than you could ever use for an 8" sub? If your eventual goal is to get a 10" or more in the truck, why bother going with the 8" only to eventually pull it out? I get that budget/time are good reasons to do a project in stages, but is an 8" sub really a stage if it will be completely thrown out when you get to the final stage?

Maybe I'm not understanding where you want to go, but doesn't it make more sense to just get an underseat box or MTI's behind the seat box done if you know you will want more than 8" eventually?

 

[goblues38]

Isn't 500W way more than you could ever use for an 8" sub? If your eventual goal is to get a 10" or more in the truck, why bother going with the 8" only to eventually pull it out? I get that budget/time are good reasons to do a project in stages, but is an 8" sub really a stage if it will be completely thrown out when you get to the final stage?

Maybe I'm not understanding where you want to go, but doesn't it make more sense to just get an underseat box or MTI's behind the seat box done if you know you will want more than 8" eventually?

Agree here. I have 2 - 10's, and it is just barely enough with 500 watts going to the subs.

 

[melvimbe]

Agree here. I have 2 - 10's, and it is just barely enough with 500 watts going to the subs.

I am only sending 250 W to a ported 12" sub. I realize I'm right "on the edge" here, or not enough in the opinion of some, but pretty happy with it so far. The reason it was done this way is because the 8 channel amp had 250W available for sub use, avoiding having to get a second amp for the sub. If I ever upgrade, I can add an amp, a 2nd 12" sub, and new box. The only thing I'm not re-using is the single ported box.

 

[K223]

Thanks for the feedback guys. It’s pretty clear on how to move on this. Between time I have on hand for another project and spending money before the holidays all adds into my dilemma.

I had a 10” Phoenix Gold sub powered by a JL Audio Slash series 500x1 amp in my last truck for years. It was in a small fiberglass enclosure made for the under seat storage compartment and it thumped! Was plenty of bass for me. Had cars in the day with two 15’s and mega Amps. Been there done that. I even pushed two 12’s in my Iroc back in the day with a single Punch 45 at maybe 1/2 ohm. It lived, could fry and egg on it and sounded fairly decent just to say I could do it lol

Anyway a 10” in the Raptor would be awesome. Again no replacement for displacement. Unless your force fed and in this case heavily amp over powered maybe. By the way who makes a behind the seat 10” enclosure for our trucks? I’d I go his route? Otherwise I just may have to upgrade the 8” driver on the factory enclosure. I want to preserve the floor space for now.

So I will need the Zen and an amp to move forward. 12w per channel in a 70k truck? Dang, really Ford? Even high power radio’s blow that spec away. I’ll presume this is RMS power and not peak lol

I thought maybe even with the Zen I could pickup signal and get it into the Zen and power the sub to start. But it sounds like the amp and factory Signal processor is a combined component. So I hear what your saying now. Would need something like 50w to the doors/pillars and another 500 to the woof. 5 channel would be the most compact yes.

The Zen is the only choice or the best choice for us basically?

 

[melvimbe]

Here's the thread you're looking for regarding behind the seat sub.

https://www.fordraptorforum.com/threads/fitting-the-mobile-toys-behind-the-seat-sub.67473/

There was guy selling his box a short awhile ago on here. Not sure he ever sold it.