Will it be faster than a TRX???

[MTF]

They don’t. I’ve seen plenty of Shelby/Tuscany supercharged 5.0’s fail. They typically melt a piston down. Those packages aren’t engineered, they’re thrown together.

Haven't heard anything about that.
I cannot find one piece of evidence to your claim.
Do you have facts or data to support your comment.

If a piston did if fact melt, that is a sign of oil pump gear failure.
That is a problem for the 6.2L when pushing past 700 HP.
Easy fix, upgrade the oil pump gears.

Whipple doesn't throw things together, that's a pretty insulting comment to say about Whipple and Shelby.
I wouldn't be surprised to find out that Whipple did in fact have that setup on Ford's dyno for durability testing.
It was done for the Raptor's 6.2L

 

[FordTechOne]

Haven't heard anything about that.
I cannot find one piece of evidence to your claim.
Do you have facts or data to support your comment.

If a piston did if fact melt, that is a sign of oil pump gear failure.
That is a problem for the 6.2L when pushing past 700 HP.
Easy fix, upgrade the oil pump gears.

2017 “Shelby” supercharged F-150 5.0. It’s on it’s 2nd engine failure, piston melted down. It has nothing to with oil pump gears, it’s caused by preignition, which is not uncommon when you add forced induction to a high compression engine that was never designed for boost.

Whipple doesn't throw things together, that's a pretty insulting comment to say about Whipple and Shelby.
I wouldn't be surprised to find out that Whipple did in fact have that setup on Ford's dyno for durability testing.
It was done for the Raptor's 6.2L

Shelby doesn’t even build their own F-150 model; they’re built by Tuscany in Indiana. Throwing an aftermarket supercharger setup on a engine that was never designed for boost and selling it for $120,000 as a package is hack at best; many people think they’re buying a genuine Ford Shelby product from the dealer when in fact they’re getting an overpriced aftermarket kit that is not engineered, but instead cobbled together from various aftermarket parts. There is no OE durability testing on any of the modifications, there is no crash testing, there is no powertrain warranty past 3/36.

 

[MTF]

OK, you have one out of tens of thousands sold.
How long ago was this?
There could be other reasons and probably are why this particular Shelby has had two failures.

Like I said, I can't find that this is common or even a problem on the net.
Us SC Raptors have had a few issues, which have been worked out.
Tens of thousands Whippled and Roush 6.2L are blasting around now.

Why are you so bitter against aftermarket???

They are the ones that push the limits of what can be achieved so the knowledge can be past down to the manufacture, be it Shelby or Roush.
There are part of the reason you have a job!!!
I can see talking trash about Hennessey because they are.

 

[FordTechOne]

OK, you have one out of thousands sold. How long ago was this?
There could be other reasons why this particular Shelby has had two failures.
Like I said, I can't find that this is common or even a problem on the net.
Us SC Raptors have had a few issues, which have been worked out.
Tens of thousands Whippled and Roush 6.2L are blasting around now.

Why are you so bitter against aftermarket???

They are the ones that push the limits of what can be achieved so the knowledge can be past down to the manufacture, be it Shelby or Roush.

I can see talking trash about Hennessey because they are.

That is one of many, and it's not just Shelby; Roush is just as bad. The picture I posted was from earlier this year. There is a big difference between actual field experience and what you see on the net. Shelby/Tuscany doesn't build high volume; they only build 750 trucks per year, and the majority aren't even supercharged. That being considered, the failure rates are high, especially since many will be show car/garage queens and will never even see boost.

The reason this Shelby had 2 engine failures is the same as the rest of them; they threw a supercharger on a high compression engine designed for natural aspiration. These companies are all about one thing, exploiting a badge to make a profit. As I mentioned before, they do not meet any OE durability standards. A 5.0 Coyote supercharged to 770HP would be nothing more than a pile of broken parts after a single day of Ford OE durability testing. I suggest you read "Iron Fist, Lead Foot" which documents Chief Engineer John Coletti's journey to get the 4.6 Terminator engine to pass durability testing; and that was with low compression on only 8 lbs of boost.

Manufacturers do not care what Shelby or Roush are doing in the aftermarket. They are not interested in pushing powertrains to their breaking point in order to advertise the highest number. I've love to see the carnage of a Shelby or Roush Supercharged 5.0 attempting to pull it's maximum tow rating up Davis Dam, which is another OE standard. It wouldn't be pretty.

I'm not against aftermarket; I've modified my fair share of vehicles, including my 2004 Cobra. But I am against companies like Shelby/Tuscany taking a brand new vehicle, upfitting it with untested and unproven modifications, and then marketing it as a special package that is equivalent to an OE model. The majority of consumers have no idea that they're buying a brand new vehicle that has been hacked up and half-assed; they only see "Shelby" and assume it's the same as a factory Ford Shelby product. And when the break, and they do, the consumer is left hanging while the upfitter tries to get Ford to pay for the repairs.

 

[MTF]

I get that pushing an engine to it's limits has draw backs.
I'm sure I could toast my stock engine if I beat the shit out of it.
Luckily I still have half a brain and drive it within reason.

If I want long lasting durability I'd have to upgrade, that's a given.

My point I'm trying to make is, it is feasible to get the HP.
Now it's up to Ford to make it happen.
I wouldn't have a problem paying more.

The TRX and the Hummer EV sold out in hours or even minutes.

All I'm saying is, "if you build it they will come".

I want to be in a Ford and continue to be King of the pickup trucks. LOL

 

[K223]

That is one of many, and it's not just Shelby; Roush is just as bad. The picture I posted was from earlier this year. There is a big difference between actual field experience and what you see on the net. Shelby/Tuscany doesn't build high volume; they only build 750 trucks per year, and the majority aren't even supercharged. That being considered, the failure rates are high, especially since many will be show car/garage queens and will never even see boost.

The reason this Shelby had 2 engine failures is the same as the rest of them; they threw a supercharger on a high compression engine designed for natural aspiration. These companies are all about one thing, exploiting a badge to make a profit. As I mentioned before, they do not meet any OE durability standards. A 5.0 Coyote supercharged to 770HP would be nothing more than a pile of broken parts after a single day of Ford OE durability testing. I suggest you read "Iron Fist, Lead Foot" which documents Chief Engineer John Coletti's journey to get the 4.6 Terminator engine to pass durability testing; and that was with low compression on only 8 lbs of boost.

Manufacturers do not care what Shelby or Roush are doing in the aftermarket. They are not interested in pushing powertrains to their breaking point in order to advertise the highest number. I've love to see the carnage of a Shelby or Roush Supercharged 5.0 attempting to pull it's maximum tow rating up Davis Dam, which is another OE standard. It wouldn't be pretty.

I'm not against aftermarket; I've modified my fair share of vehicles, including my 2004 Cobra. But I am against companies like Shelby/Tuscany taking a brand new vehicle, upfitting it with untested and unproven modifications, and then marketing it as a special package that is equivalent to an OE model. The majority of consumers have no idea that they're buying a brand new vehicle that has been hacked up and half-assed; they only see "Shelby" and assume it's the same as a factory Ford Shelby product. And when the break, and they do, the consumer is left hanging while the upfitter tries to get Ford to pay for the repairs.

You can modify vehicles, and you can build gobs of power. These third party’s are doing it. But you will also have a respect for what the factory has designed and the general reliability they build into it. Day in and day out. Thousands of vehicles don’t lie. The testing they do and the refinements they make are something.

I’d take 800HP of factory power over 800HP of homemade power any day. I’d also take 650HP vs 800HP from a known but smaller company any day in a vehicle I plan to push hard or drive daily. Not to mention markups are unreal from these third party outfitters.

 

[MTF]

Edited: After getting the right HP and Torque #s from FordTechOne
So my thinking is, Ford only has a few options to kill the Raptor killer.

1)The new Predator 5.2L
Bullet proof the new 5.2L and throw the 3L Whipple on it and reTune. But that won't happen.
What I'd like to see:
Build an even better CAI system than the TRX.
Design a bigger better cooling system for everything, HE, oil, trans, coolant and PS.
Bigger better cooling vents in the hood and fenders.
I like the Killer Chiller concept, maybe incorporate that, possibly make an electric compressor for it or a dual function AC compressor.

2) Bring back the 6.2L, stronger, better and lighter and add the new Gen5 3L Whipple.
I'd even go with the Eco Boost

3) Pull the 5.8L back into production with the Whipple (and deTune it for durability), possibly the Eaton, but wrong direction in weight.

4) Throw in the Godzilla with the the Eaton blower on and hope it could get the numbers,
but it would make the Raptor stupid heavy again. And it's not designed for boost but neither is the current 6.2L

To me, option one makes the most sense, and is most likely.

I bet people would jump right on that!

 

[K223]

So my thinking is, Ford only has a few options to kill the Raptor killer.

1) Bring back the 6.2L, stronger, better and lighter and add the new Gen5 3L Whipple.
I'd even go with the Eco Boost

2) Bullet proof the 5L or the new 5.2L and throw the Whipple on it.
and build an even better CAI system than the TRX.
Design a bigger better cooling system for everything, HE, oil, trans, coolant and PS.
Bigger better cooling vents in the hood and fenders.
I like the Killer Chiller concept, maybe incorporate that, possibly make an electric compressor for it.

3) Pull the 5.8L back into production with the Whipple (and deTune it for durability), possibly the Eaton, but wrong direction in weight.

4) Throw in the Godzilla with the the Eaton blower on and hope it could get the numbers,
but it would make the Raptor stupid heavy again. And it's not designed for boost but neither is the current 6.2L

To me, option one makes the most sense.
Option 2 would be better since it would shed a few pounds.
Even if they make it an upgrade option for $$$
It doesn't need be in the same caliber as the GT's 6 banger


I bet people would jump right on that!

If Ford wants to battle numbers against the TRX. And if they go with a V8 as the standard or an optional engine, the 5.2 Predator is already sitting in there arsenal. Mind you it may need some further tuning or changes to work for a truck(weight, TQ curve, etc). But that should be a simple task for the engine folks over there.

I really don’t see OEM’s bringing back an engine design from the dead. Especially one being around 10 years old. Mind you the size of it may come back, but the design would be very different. Seems like Ford has gone the way of GM and FCA with new na V8 push rod simple designs, which are still proven and compact. Supercharged V8’s are another story.

In the next year give or take, we will soon see what Fords strategy is. What will get V8’s and what they will be. The Hybrid will show up and soon EV. Interesting for sure.

 

[MTF]

The 6.2L is a work horse and has or should I say had a growing aftermarket.

This would have no problems killing the Raptor Killer
https://www.livernoismotorsports.com/product/LPP750129

I forgot about the 6.6L from Livernois.
And I don't believe it has ever been paired with Whipple's new Gen5 3L
Simple because it won't fit under the cowl in the Gen 1 Raptor
Would love to see it going through Ford's Dyno durability testing.

 

[FordTechOne]

So my thinking is, Ford only has a few options to kill the Raptor killer.

1) Bring back the 6.2L, stronger, better and lighter and add the new Gen5 3L Whipple.
I'd even go with the Eco Boost

2) Bullet proof the 5L or the new 5.2L and throw the Whipple on it.
and build an even better CAI system than the TRX.
Design a bigger better cooling system for everything, HE, oil, trans, coolant and PS.
Bigger better cooling vents in the hood and fenders.
I like the Killer Chiller concept, maybe incorporate that, possibly make an electric compressor for it.

3) Pull the 5.8L back into production with the Whipple (and deTune it for durability), possibly the Eaton, but wrong direction in weight.

4) Throw in the Godzilla with the the Eaton blower on and hope it could get the numbers,
but it would make the Raptor stupid heavy again. And it's not designed for boost but neither is the current 6.2L

To me, option one makes the most sense.
Option 2 would be better since it would shed a few pounds.
Even if they make it an upgrade option for $$$
It doesn't need be in the same caliber as the GT's 6 banger


I bet people would jump right on that!

The 5.2 Predator is already making 760HP with a TVS; it certainly doesn’t need an aftermarket supercharger. If they offer an optional V8, that engine is a given.