Freeway speed stutter

[tlnt60]

Hi all, so I seem to have an issue when at freeway speeds. So when I’m on the freeway and the truck is in 10th gear, I give it 3/4 throttle to pass and it drops to 6th gear, then there is a noticeable amount of time (3-4 seconds) where nothing happened, it’s like the truck falls flat on its face. The boost gauge is reading full boost, but nothing is happening, barley accelerates and it’s almost dangerous.... someone had suggested running SP-542 plugs, but wanted to see if anyone else has had the issue and resolved it.

Also, I did take it to the dealer and they were able to replicate it, had a trans tech and reg tech in the truck, no miss fire, nothing, so they said they couldn’t hunt it down any further....

 

[ArmyTanker]

I had the same thing but also a smell of running rich on start up. I bought mass air flow sensor cleaner, and cleaned the MAF. I also did the throttle position reset procedure and both of those corrected my issue (see attached). Might be worth a try?

 

[tlnt60]

I d

I had the same thing but also a smell of running rich on start up. I bought mass air flow sensor cleaner, and cleaned the MAF. I also did the throttle position reset procedure and both of those corrected my issue (see attached). Might be worth a try?

View attachment 126528

I Definitely smell super rich at start up. I assumed it was a result of a TT engine. I can try that for sure.

 

[ArmyTanker]

I d


I Definitely smell super rich at start up. I assumed it was a result of a TT engine. I can try that for sure.

 

[COBB Tuning]

If you have any way to datalog your truck, take a look at what your cam phasers are doing when this happens. Cam position is a real cornerstone of EcoBoost Ford tuning, and will determine which ignition timing tables, load limit tables, volumetric efficiency tables, etc. are being used. Cam phasers use oil pressure to advance/retard the intake and exhaust camshafts. If oil level is too low, oil pressure could be too low to properly actuate the phasers, throwing all of the downstream systems out of whack.

The VCT system is highly variable depending on driving conditions, so it's hard to say what sort of cam position you should expect at 'x' load, 'x' rpm, etc. BUT, if you see that VCT-E Actual and VCT-I Actual positions are stuck at 0* for a prolonged period, you can assume that the phasers are not operating correctly.

I know any mention of cam phasers can cause panic, and that's not my suggestion here. Rather than the phasers themselves being faulty, I would bet that low oil level or oil sloshing away from the pickup (and therefore low oil pressure) would be the culprit.

The Raptor does not use a MAF for measuring airflow (they operate on a speed density strategy), so I would not bother with that. Throttle learning is, in my opinion, unlikely to be an issue. But throttle behavior is also something that you could log to double check that theory.

As a testament to this theory, I saw a datalog of a vehicle where the phasers were stuck at 0*, and final highest individual cylinder ignition timing was some 8-10* less than what you would expect to see on a normally operating truck. That represents a HUGE loss in power - these engines are extremely timing sensitive for power. And it all boils down to the cams not being phased as expected/appropriately, and different ignition timing tables being used that commanded drastically less timing.

No promises that this is the issue, but it is certainly something to check! Let us know what you find!

Best,
Sam@Cobb

 

[tlnt60]

If you have any way to datalog your truck, take a look at what your cam phasers are doing when this happens. Cam position is a real cornerstone of EcoBoost Ford tuning, and will determine which ignition timing tables, load limit tables, volumetric efficiency tables, etc. are being used. Cam phasers use oil pressure to advance/retard the intake and exhaust camshafts. If oil level is too low, oil pressure could be too low to properly actuate the phasers, throwing all of the downstream systems out of whack.

The VCT system is highly variable depending on driving conditions, so it's hard to say what sort of cam position you should expect at 'x' load, 'x' rpm, etc. BUT, if you see that VCT-E Actual and VCT-I Actual positions are stuck at 0* for a prolonged period, you can assume that the phasers are not operating correctly.

I know any mention of cam phasers can cause panic, and that's not my suggestion here. Rather than the phasers themselves being faulty, I would bet that low oil level or oil sloshing away from the pickup (and therefore low oil pressure) would be the culprit.

The Raptor does not use a MAF for measuring airflow (they operate on a speed density strategy), so I would not bother with that. Throttle learning is, in my opinion, unlikely to be an issue. But throttle behavior is also something that you could log to double check that theory.

As a testament to this theory, I saw a datalog of a vehicle where the phasers were stuck at 0*, and final highest individual cylinder ignition timing was some 8-10* less than what you would expect to see on a normally operating truck. That represents a HUGE loss in power - these engines are extremely timing sensitive for power. And it all boils down to the cams not being phased as expected/appropriately, and different ignition timing tables being used that commanded drastically less timing.

No promises that this is the issue, but it is certainly something to check! Let us know what you find!

Best,
Sam@Cobb

thanks for the suggestion.... I don’t have a tune so I don’t have logger. I am worried about tuning and the warranty tbh since I don’t truly know how ford will react to a failure and having a tune installed (I would remove before service, but wonder if they still have a way to see if it was tuned), especially if it turns out to be the cam phasers. Having said that, I wonder if there is a way to ensure the dealer actually checks cam position when this issue is occurring. The most interesting part is that I can replicate it super easy every time.....

 

[goblues38]

(I would remove before service, but wonder if they still have a way to see if it was tuned), .

short answer is YES. they know you had it tuned.

The long answer is.....Every time you flash the computer with a new tune, or go back to stock, a time stamp is made on the software change. So Ford can look at the logs, see the time stamps, and if your truck was not in for service during that time, they know you were messing around with the software, which is a violation of the EULA and a means for them to deny warranty service for related parts.

Now, to do what i wrote above, the service tech has to be so inclined to do that detective work. Some dealers do, many do not. All depends on your dealer.

Since Ford ultimately pays the dealer for an warranty work......a high dollar fix like an engine swap will get the software more scrutinized the an easy fix like a throttle body.

that is the risk reward you have to weigh when deciding on a tune or not. Only you can decide if you want to risk it. it may be fine......or you may have to pay $2k for a new turbo because warranty was denied.

 

[tlnt60]

short answer is YES. they know you had it tuned.

The long answer is.....Every time you flash the computer with a new tune, or go back to stock, a time stamp is made on the software change. So Ford can look at the logs, see the time stamps, and if your truck was not in for service during that time, they know you were messing around with the software, which is a violation of the EULA and a means for them to deny warranty service for related parts.

Now, to do what i wrote above, the service tech has to be so inclined to do that detective work. Some dealers do, many do not. All depends on your dealer.

Since Ford ultimately pays the dealer for an warranty work......a high dollar fix like an engine swap will get the software more scrutinized the an easy fix like a throttle body.

that is the risk reward you have to weigh when deciding on a tune or not. Only you can decide if you want to risk it. it may be fine......or you may have to pay $2k for a new turbo because warranty was denied.

Thanks, that makes perfect sense, and for me, the risk/reward says that I won’t be tuning the truck as I truly just don’t trust that something won’t go wrong again (even tho I truly believe most of the tuners here would never be the problem) and ford would blame it on the tuner potentially. With my C63 I wasn’t worried about tuning since I knew the engine was pretty much bulletproof and that any repairs would have not been full engine replacement.

the worst part is that I believe a lot of the issue with this truck would be solved with a good tune (mpt, Cobb, JDM) but don’t trust this motor.

As far as the shutter goes, I’m trying a new dealer next week as my current one just flat out blew me off, so maybe they will look into it. After that, I will reach out to ford...