verytalonted
Full Access Member
If there is any Ford Techs out there I would appreciate their insight.
So here is my long winded story of how my local dealership and aftermarket warranty company is trying to get me to pay for my reverse camera repairs:
Reverse Camera:
Symptoms: Fuzzy/foggy camera display all the time, intermittent flipped image, intermittent flashing between white screen and camera image (strobe like)
9-Aug-13: Truck was dropped off. I was told that they were 4-5 days behind and that it may take that long to look at truck.
13-Aug-13: First call back. Juan from Jim Bass called and left message on phone. I call back and am told that the Reverse Camera is broken and will need replacing. He also tells me that the Factory Warranty is expired on the camera and cost will be approx $867 for repairs. I tell Juan to get in touch with McCombs Ford West (where I bought truck and aftermarket warranty from) to get information of aftermarket warranty. Juan says he will call me back when he gets it.
14-Aug-13: Juan calls again leaving message on phone telling me to call him. I call back and Juan tells me that he got in touch with ‘Old Republic’ (my aftermarket warranty company) and they are only going to pay $513, but I will still have to pay $350. I asked why it was not covered, and he says that Old Republic is not going to cover a ‘chrome bezel/housing’ for the camera and that it will break when removing the camera. So, I have to buy a new chrome bezel/housing for the camera. And I will have to pay the $50 deductable from Old Republic. I get the information to contact Old Republic and we hang up.
I then call McCombs Ford West in San Antonio to see if breaking the bezel/housing is common practice in replacing the Camera. I am informed that it should not be.
Next I call Jordan Ford in San Antonio (a dealership that my family has used for repairs in the past and I trust) They tell me that if the technician is careful, nothing should have to be ‘broken’ in order to fix on the camera, and that the camera unbolts from the bezel/housing. He even provides me with Ford part numbers so that I can research more on my own.
I begin searching on the internet for camera install jobs on similar trucks like mine. I find that the bezel/housing unbolts from the tailgate (2 bolts), and on the back side of the bezel/housing, the camera assembly is held in place by a ‘cradle’ that has three bolt that holds it in place on the back side of the bezel/housing. I also learn that the camera and wire harness are a two piece design with a ‘quick disconnect’ that allows them to be separated easily.
(See Photos below)
I finally call my aftermarket warranty company (Old Republic) I explain what Juan at Jim Bass told me and asked what they are actually paying for. I am told that Old Republic is covering the Camera ($409), one hour of labor that is called for the replacement of a rear camera ($120), and $30 worth of taxes. I tell him that they are trying to charge me for chrome bezel/housing for the camera and that Juan at Jim Bass said that it must be broken to fix it, and how I am going to pay for this. Gary at Old Republic chuckled a bit upon hearing this unique way of ‘fixing’ things. He tells me that that doesn’t sound right and wishes me good luck.
Now, I call Juan at Jim Bass again to tell him what I have learned. I explain to him that the bezel/housing should not have to ‘purposely broken’ in order to remove it, and go on to tell him how that bezel/housing is replaced. He quickly changes his tune from ‘has to’ to ‘most likely’ will be broken. And he offers that I talk to his technician, as he doesn’t actually know what he is talking about. I then ask him what my $300 is covering. He informs me, very vaguely, that the $300 is covering a chrome bezel/housing for the camera, 1 hr labor for install, something called ‘shop supplies’ and a wiring harness. I fist ask him to elaborate on what ‘shop supplies’ is. He tells me at first that it is for ‘oil and rags’ then changes it to ‘glue’ when I further ask why my rear camera needs oil and/or rags. Next I question the need of a wire harness for my truck, since all that was found wrong was a camera. Juan then tells me that the new camera will not hook up properly to my truck (even though my truck has had a factory installed camera since it was built). I tell him that the harness would not be needed if they ordered the correct camera, as the plugs will match up. He again suggests I come down and talk to the technician, and plays the ‘dumb’ middle man role. He then tells me that if they end up not breaking my bezel/housing he will knock off $60 off the overall price. Funny it took him this long to mention that. Nothing is said about any of the other prices.
15-Aug-13: I call Jim Bass and catch Juan as he is getting out of a morning insurance meeting; I ask him if there is any way that he can email me itemized copy of all the costs for both my aftermarket warranty and what I am expected to pay. He seems reluctant but complies, stating that it will take him a while to get it together since they are “really backed up”.
My Questions:
• Why do I need to pay for labor on a part that is already being charged to my warranty company?
(If the bezel/housing removal and reinstall is a necessary part of the camera replacement, what am I paying again for it? Add the warranty company has allotted 1hr already.)
• Why was I going to be charged for an optional part that I may have not needed? Would I have been reimbursed if it was not needed? Even before I knew to ask?
• Why do I need a new wire harness, why not order the correct camera?
• Why does a job like mine need ‘shop supplies’? Surely, this is meant for bigger jobs not plugging in a camera?
Since then I have only been in email contact with Juan. He is what has transpired thus far:
1st Email to Me:
housing kit - 32.25
camera asy - 471.24
name plate - 49.51
wire asy - 25.27
labor - 240.00
shop supplies - 28.80
taxes 50.08
TOTAL - 897.15
extended warranty paying -513.58
whats owed 383.57 if you wanted to fix, if just want to pick up let me know
thanks
My response to Juan:
Mr. Gonzalez,
Thanks for the quick response.
I was hoping for something less vague. I asked you for an ‘itemized list’ of components need for my camera repairs. Perhaps it was my error; I should have been more specific.
I was requesting a complete write up of everything you want to order for my truck by part numbers. Please also provide an itemized breakdown of the $240 labor charge.
What is ‘shop supplies’? Can you break that down into specific supplies you will need?
Basically I want to see exactly why you ‘need’ every penny and where it is going. Why do you ‘need’ items and additional labor that my warranty company deems as frivolous and wasteful?
Many thanks in advance for getting that information for me, as it eases my mind into releasing my hard-earned money for only the most necessary of parts and labor.
Thanks again,
--Chris
His reply back to Me:
The shop supplies is a percentage of labor that is on every ticket of things that we will need through out the shop, like shop rags, adhesives and so on, every shop has this charge. The 240.00 dollar labor charge is 120.00 diag and 120.00 replacement of the camera. The housing kits part # AL3Z 19H511 A,
camera asy AL3Z 19G490 A, name plate CL3Z 9942528 B, wire asy AL3Z 14A411 C. The parts department when looking up this camera has a list that Ford says is need to do this repair.
Thanks
--Juan
Any insight on if they are ordering other parts than what I need?
and is it common to have 1 hr of diagnosis AND 1 hr of labor for this job?
Thanks soooo much in advance!!!
So here is my long winded story of how my local dealership and aftermarket warranty company is trying to get me to pay for my reverse camera repairs:
Reverse Camera:
Symptoms: Fuzzy/foggy camera display all the time, intermittent flipped image, intermittent flashing between white screen and camera image (strobe like)
9-Aug-13: Truck was dropped off. I was told that they were 4-5 days behind and that it may take that long to look at truck.
13-Aug-13: First call back. Juan from Jim Bass called and left message on phone. I call back and am told that the Reverse Camera is broken and will need replacing. He also tells me that the Factory Warranty is expired on the camera and cost will be approx $867 for repairs. I tell Juan to get in touch with McCombs Ford West (where I bought truck and aftermarket warranty from) to get information of aftermarket warranty. Juan says he will call me back when he gets it.
14-Aug-13: Juan calls again leaving message on phone telling me to call him. I call back and Juan tells me that he got in touch with ‘Old Republic’ (my aftermarket warranty company) and they are only going to pay $513, but I will still have to pay $350. I asked why it was not covered, and he says that Old Republic is not going to cover a ‘chrome bezel/housing’ for the camera and that it will break when removing the camera. So, I have to buy a new chrome bezel/housing for the camera. And I will have to pay the $50 deductable from Old Republic. I get the information to contact Old Republic and we hang up.
I then call McCombs Ford West in San Antonio to see if breaking the bezel/housing is common practice in replacing the Camera. I am informed that it should not be.
Next I call Jordan Ford in San Antonio (a dealership that my family has used for repairs in the past and I trust) They tell me that if the technician is careful, nothing should have to be ‘broken’ in order to fix on the camera, and that the camera unbolts from the bezel/housing. He even provides me with Ford part numbers so that I can research more on my own.
I begin searching on the internet for camera install jobs on similar trucks like mine. I find that the bezel/housing unbolts from the tailgate (2 bolts), and on the back side of the bezel/housing, the camera assembly is held in place by a ‘cradle’ that has three bolt that holds it in place on the back side of the bezel/housing. I also learn that the camera and wire harness are a two piece design with a ‘quick disconnect’ that allows them to be separated easily.
(See Photos below)
I finally call my aftermarket warranty company (Old Republic) I explain what Juan at Jim Bass told me and asked what they are actually paying for. I am told that Old Republic is covering the Camera ($409), one hour of labor that is called for the replacement of a rear camera ($120), and $30 worth of taxes. I tell him that they are trying to charge me for chrome bezel/housing for the camera and that Juan at Jim Bass said that it must be broken to fix it, and how I am going to pay for this. Gary at Old Republic chuckled a bit upon hearing this unique way of ‘fixing’ things. He tells me that that doesn’t sound right and wishes me good luck.
Now, I call Juan at Jim Bass again to tell him what I have learned. I explain to him that the bezel/housing should not have to ‘purposely broken’ in order to remove it, and go on to tell him how that bezel/housing is replaced. He quickly changes his tune from ‘has to’ to ‘most likely’ will be broken. And he offers that I talk to his technician, as he doesn’t actually know what he is talking about. I then ask him what my $300 is covering. He informs me, very vaguely, that the $300 is covering a chrome bezel/housing for the camera, 1 hr labor for install, something called ‘shop supplies’ and a wiring harness. I fist ask him to elaborate on what ‘shop supplies’ is. He tells me at first that it is for ‘oil and rags’ then changes it to ‘glue’ when I further ask why my rear camera needs oil and/or rags. Next I question the need of a wire harness for my truck, since all that was found wrong was a camera. Juan then tells me that the new camera will not hook up properly to my truck (even though my truck has had a factory installed camera since it was built). I tell him that the harness would not be needed if they ordered the correct camera, as the plugs will match up. He again suggests I come down and talk to the technician, and plays the ‘dumb’ middle man role. He then tells me that if they end up not breaking my bezel/housing he will knock off $60 off the overall price. Funny it took him this long to mention that. Nothing is said about any of the other prices.
15-Aug-13: I call Jim Bass and catch Juan as he is getting out of a morning insurance meeting; I ask him if there is any way that he can email me itemized copy of all the costs for both my aftermarket warranty and what I am expected to pay. He seems reluctant but complies, stating that it will take him a while to get it together since they are “really backed up”.
My Questions:
• Why do I need to pay for labor on a part that is already being charged to my warranty company?
(If the bezel/housing removal and reinstall is a necessary part of the camera replacement, what am I paying again for it? Add the warranty company has allotted 1hr already.)
• Why was I going to be charged for an optional part that I may have not needed? Would I have been reimbursed if it was not needed? Even before I knew to ask?
• Why do I need a new wire harness, why not order the correct camera?
• Why does a job like mine need ‘shop supplies’? Surely, this is meant for bigger jobs not plugging in a camera?
Since then I have only been in email contact with Juan. He is what has transpired thus far:
1st Email to Me:
housing kit - 32.25
camera asy - 471.24
name plate - 49.51
wire asy - 25.27
labor - 240.00
shop supplies - 28.80
taxes 50.08
TOTAL - 897.15
extended warranty paying -513.58
whats owed 383.57 if you wanted to fix, if just want to pick up let me know
thanks
My response to Juan:
Mr. Gonzalez,
Thanks for the quick response.
I was hoping for something less vague. I asked you for an ‘itemized list’ of components need for my camera repairs. Perhaps it was my error; I should have been more specific.
I was requesting a complete write up of everything you want to order for my truck by part numbers. Please also provide an itemized breakdown of the $240 labor charge.
What is ‘shop supplies’? Can you break that down into specific supplies you will need?
Basically I want to see exactly why you ‘need’ every penny and where it is going. Why do you ‘need’ items and additional labor that my warranty company deems as frivolous and wasteful?
Many thanks in advance for getting that information for me, as it eases my mind into releasing my hard-earned money for only the most necessary of parts and labor.
Thanks again,
--Chris
His reply back to Me:
The shop supplies is a percentage of labor that is on every ticket of things that we will need through out the shop, like shop rags, adhesives and so on, every shop has this charge. The 240.00 dollar labor charge is 120.00 diag and 120.00 replacement of the camera. The housing kits part # AL3Z 19H511 A,
camera asy AL3Z 19G490 A, name plate CL3Z 9942528 B, wire asy AL3Z 14A411 C. The parts department when looking up this camera has a list that Ford says is need to do this repair.
Thanks
--Juan
Any insight on if they are ordering other parts than what I need?
and is it common to have 1 hr of diagnosis AND 1 hr of labor for this job?
Thanks soooo much in advance!!!
