CA Moves to Kill the ICE

[jabroni619]

First, you can't generate enough renewable energy. Second, renewable energy isn't free. The amount of energy required to build a windmill or a solar farm is enormous. Mining, refining, multiple levels of manufacturing, energy gets burned at each stage. And no, ethanol isn't the answer. A corn ethanol plant runs off of fossil fuel because if it ran on ethanol, there wouldn't be much left. Ethanol fuel is welfare for corn farmers. By the time you add in the fuel and fertilizer needed to grow the corn, we would use less net fossil fuel if we had no ethanol program at all. Other biofuels? Basically, you're burning wood for power. A giant leap into the 19th century. Solar is probably the closest to viability, but storage is a problem. Maybe if we required that everyone have their electric car plugged in whenever the sun shines, you could use the car batteries for storage.

So you’re saying the fuel we’ve been consuming for over a century is still the cleanest and most efficient form of energy for a vehicle? There’s a phrase for that. It’s called bull ******* shit.

we have multiple sources of energy ranging from hydro, wind, solar, nuclear and coal. Even if you use coal to generate the electricity, it’s still more efficient than using petroleum to move a vehicle.

obviously energy will need to be consumed to build out the infrastructure. But you make it sound like that energy is so insurmountable that we would never see a net benefit from that investment. Again, bull ******* shit.

 

[Icecobra]

For many years now most trains are electric. They generate electricity from diesel generators to power the electric trains. Its not rocket science you can generate electricity in a car the same way. The car is lighter you need fewer batteries if you have a power plant in the car. The future of cars is battery storage combined with better generators, and solar panels on the car to generate the power. This means short trips use just battery power and longer trips will use diesel generators to go hundreds of miles in one trip. It's the future were headed for.

 

[Diesel71]

So you’re saying the fuel we’ve been consuming for over a century is still the cleanest and most efficient form of energy for a vehicle? There’s a phrase for that. It’s called bull ******* shit.

we have multiple sources of energy ranging from hydro, wind, solar, nuclear and coal. Even if you use coal to generate the electricity, it’s still more efficient than using petroleum to move a vehicle.

obviously energy will need to be consumed to build out the infrastructure. But you make it sound like that energy is so insurmountable that we would never see a net benefit from that investment. Again, bull ******* shit.

Who pissed in your cheerios? And your statement about coal is flat out false, so the hypocrisy of you calling ******** on anyone is laughable. Oh and you didn't touch on disposal of these wonderful, coal built electric batteries. That is a whole other giant issue.

 

[jabroni619]

Who pissed in your cheerios? And your statement about coal is flat out false, so the hypocrisy of you calling ******** on anyone is laughable. Oh and you didn't touch on disposal of these wonderful, coal built electric batteries. That is a whole other giant issue.

I encourage you to watch the 3 hour Tesla Battery day event. It’ll make you slightly less ignorant. At least as far as batteries are concerned. Again, If you’re if the opinion that modern tech is “less green” than what we’ve been using for century+ to propel our vehicles, you’re too... dense to have this discussion.

Let me ask you this, why do you think a hybrid is more efficient than a comparable gas only vehicle even though it has the added weight of batteries and electric motors?

 

[saym14]

Two words
Red Barchetta

 

[GordoJay]

So you’re saying the fuel we’ve been consuming for over a century is still the cleanest and most efficient form of energy for a vehicle?

Most efficient? Absolutely. The true basis for the world economy is energy. The cash price of any product very closely approximates the total energy required to produce it. The reason we use fossil fuel is that it's cheap and abundant enough to be the most efficient. This is really elementary stuff. If the total cost of buying and driving your EV, without counting subsidies, is more than the cost of buying the equivalent ICE-powered vehicle, it used more energy.

There’s a phrase for that. It’s called bull ******* shit.

Were you just trolling for an argument? Or do you really want to discuss the issue? There's no need to be rude. Unless you can't rebut with facts. Then insult is your only option. When I'm arguing with someone and they stoop to insult, it's the signal that I've won.

we have multiple sources of energy ranging from hydro, wind, solar, nuclear and coal. Even if you use coal to generate the electricity, it’s still more efficient than using petroleum to move a vehicle.

Hydro is tapped out. Wind is expensive, intermittent, and kills huge numbers of endangered birds. Nuclear is clean, but the enviro nut jobs have pretty much shut it down. Solar is the best bet currently. Last time I looked, maybe five years ago, here in Colorado, burning gas was better for the environment than driving an EV because we use coal for our electricity. I doubt that has changed in five years, but at some point it will reach a tipping point.

obviously energy will need to be consumed to build out the infrastructure. But you make it sound like that energy is so insurmountable that we would never see a net benefit from that investment.

It's not insurmountable, but it isn't free. The tree-huggers routinely ignore the cost of manufacture, construction, and disposal of energy generating equipment when running their numbers. It's the only way that they can get them to pencil out. Right now there is no net benefit from wind or biofuel. Nuclear is a clear win. The cost of solar is dropping the fastest because it's based on semiconductor technology. I haven't looked at it lately, so I don't know whether it's a net benefit or not. It probably is in the sunnier southern latitudes, probably not in Minnesota.

 

[jabroni619]

I never said, suggested or implied it’s free. I’ve even acknowledged that advances still need to be made.

 

[GordoJay]

For many years now most trains are electric. They generate electricity from diesel generators to power the electric trains...

Trains are interesting. They are so heavy that the torque required to get them moving is enormous. You can't get that sort of torque from a diesel without a tranny the size of the locomotive. So electric is much better. For the same reason, an electric drive train in a car is a wonderful thing. With today's tech, the most efficient and cost-effective way to get that is to generate the electricity on the spot. Hybrid is the best technology we have today and for the near future when it comes to moving vehicles around. Electric may well have it's day, but that day won't happen in 2035. California can't keep the lights on now. Where in the heck are they going to get all the extra power they're going to need when the entire fleet is electric? Sacramento is just shoveling taxpayer money into private pockets and calling it green energy. Business as usual.

 

[saym14]

California already has brown outs and black out and they shut off the power when there are Highwinds and there is a fire safety hazard. Due to solar CA often has to PAY APS Arizona power to take the excess electricity during peak production. Having politicians dictate science and technology is going to be a $hit show. Oh wait that already describes CA.

 

[Diesel71]

I encourage you to watch the 3 hour Tesla Battery day event. It’ll make you slightly less ignorant. At least as far as batteries are concerned. Again, If you’re if the opinion that modern tech is “less green” than what we’ve been using for century+ to propel our vehicles, you’re too... dense to have this discussion.

Let me ask you this, why do you think a hybrid is more efficient than a comparable gas only vehicle even though it has the added weight of batteries and electric motors?

619 ... San Diego area code. So you are just another annoying know-it-all California ****. That whole state really needs to slide into the pacific for the betterment of mankind.