Alcon Front BBK Installed on 2019

[EricM]

Unless the rotors are a bigger diameter, I don't think you are going to gain a whole lot of braking performance.

The mechanical advantage of a larger moment arm far exceeds anything you might gain with a "same diameter" kit like a stiffer caliper, or more pad area in contact with the rotor. It will be better, but not massively so.

If it's a larger diameter rotor BBK (ie actually a BIG brake kit) though, you'll notice the difference immediately. A kit with a larger diameter rotor will stop better, have a better pedal feel, and be more easily modulated under heavy braking.

 

[T14Jeremy]

Unless the rotors are a bigger diameter, I don't think you are going to gain a whole lot of braking performance.

The mechanical advantage of a larger moment arm far exceeds anything you might gain with a "same diameter" kit like a stiffer caliper, or more pad area in contact with the rotor. It will be better, but not massively so.

If it's a larger diameter rotor BBK (ie actually a BIG brake kit) though, you'll notice the difference immediately. A kit with a larger diameter rotor will stop better, have a better pedal feel, and be more easily modulated under heavy braking.

I dont disagree with you.
The Rotors in the Alcon kit are much larger than the Raptor's stock Rotors. This is part of the reason you need to swap out your Tie Rod Ends, as the larger rotors wont clear the OE Rods.

 

[EricM]

I dont disagree with you.
The Rotors in the Alcon kit are much larger than the Raptor's stock Rotors. This is part of the reason you need to swap out your Tie Rod Ends, as the larger rotors wont clear the OE Rods.

Are they a larger diameter though, or just thicker? I don't see any reason a larger diameter rotor would affect the tie rod ends, only a thicker rotor. would do that.

 

[T14Jeremy]

Are they a larger diameter though, or just thicker? I don't see any reason a larger diameter rotor would affect the tie rod ends, only a thicker rotor. would do that.

The Alcon Rotors are both thicker, & larger in diameter. I'll see if I can find a good side by side comparison shot ( cant remember if we took one during the install ) but for reference, you need to remove the OE dust shields, as the Alcon Rotors exceed the diameter of the shields even.

 

[Nick@Apollo-Optics]

Not only are the rotors larger, the caliper is massively increased in size.

Here's testing that we did on our own shop truck of the improved performance:

Our clients with 2019 trucks that have installed the kit on the front only have noticed significant results as well.

Per Alcon, the system also remains in balance with only the front kit installed.

 

[EricM]

Our clients with 2019 trucks that have installed the kit on the front only have noticed significant results as well.

50 feet shorter. Nice.

Fronts do 80% of the braking. A BBK in the rear is simply for showing off. Factory rear brakes can easily lock up the rear tires and nobody is melting the rear pads...

Alcon should look into going with a disc that's not so wide so we can still run the stock tie rod. All that extra rotor beef isn't needed at all, we aren't lapping a road course in these things. Thermal mass is nice and all, but when it causes you to have to ream the spindle and requires other aftermarket parts, it's time to re-think if it's truly a benefit or a drawback.

 

[Fender]

Are you guys sure about the front rotor being a larger diameter? I remember it distinctly being a little smaller than stock but thicker

Yes that's what I thought,
Stock is 350x34, alcon is 347x36, so thicker but smaller diameter

 

[zombiekiller]

if you only do the fronts, you'll still experience fade in the rear. The more you use the brakes in a given "session", the more apparent that it will be.

The alcon calipers are ductile iron, the rotors are substantially thicker and tougher. They won't warp or deform and they'll actually last much longer.

There are ALLLLLL sorts of contributing factors that may guide one to spend the coin.

For me, if all i did was run a 12 mile loop a few times when i took my truck out, the brake change might not be worth it.

When I'm on a run in Baja and we're doing anywhere from 80 miles in a day, all the way up to 400 miles in a day, i get SERIOUS brake fade after about 2 hours.

I left foot brake. I trail brake. I am not nice to brakes. I am running 40s. My wheel/tire combo is 18 lbs per corner heavier than stock. I have added probably 500 lbs to the truck and carry about 600-700 lbs in the "bed" at all times.

then when you factor the high potential for splitting a CV boot, getting moly grease on the brakes and things getting "sporty", the braking improvement seems logical. ( especially if the 50 feet that you save in stopping distance is the last 50 feet before taking a header into a boulder).

TMX is currently modifying my mid-travel spindles to accommodate the Alcon kit. I can't wait to try it out.

 

[Nick@Apollo-Optics]

Alcon should look into going with a disc that's not so wide so we can still run the stock tie rod. All that extra rotor beef isn't needed at all, we aren't lapping a road course in these things. Thermal mass is nice and all, but when it causes you to have to ream the spindle and requires other aftermarket parts, it's time to re-think if it's truly a benefit or a drawback.

I tend to disagree with you on the brake fade. We've seen guys melt brakes at Raptor runs just running around the track at TRR. Also, as far as reaming the spindle, yes technically you are reaming it out, but honestly, about 10 seconds with a 5/8 drill bit is all it takes to make the tire rode adapter fit and you're upgrading the part. But the purpose for the tie rod adapter is really because of Ford's tie rods more than anything. Two different manufacturers for the OEM tie rods, some clear and some don't. And there's been no rhyme or reason to which trucks need it and which ones doe not. We've run into the same issue with Wilwood kits. To combat this, we recommend you purchase the tie rod adapter kit with your brakes. However, if you end up not needing them, we'll send you a shipping label to return the adapters back to us.

Are you guys sure about the front rotor being a larger diameter? I remember it distinctly being a little smaller than stock but thicker

Yes that's what I thought,
Stock is 350x34, alcon is 347x36, so thicker but smaller diameter

You're right. I was thinking of the rears. 360mm. The fronts are 347mm due to the larger calipers.

 

[EricM]

Now that we have the size clarified, with it being the same sized rotor as stock, I'm very surprised there is such a massive difference in stopping distances. A 30% reduction in stopping distance with the same sized rotors and no change in the master cylinder seems- odd. Not doubting your test results though- I'm sure you are not faking anything here. I gotta think that most of that is in the pad material vs the OEM pads.

Do we have numbers on the piston area vs stock calipers?

What pads due they use in these? Are they standard pad sizes from a production vehicle or are they proprietary?