Guys with icons ?

[justvettn]

 

[Wilson]

oohhh he for got to say race inspired for the raptor stock shocks. but the aftermarket shocks are inspired to race.

 

[wanderfalk]

when i spoke to fox they told me that their shocks were designed for folks that what to drive fast and hard offroad so really not much effort has gone in to tuning for hitting the small stuff going 25mph. my use of the term racing shocks is being taken literally(my fault) when a more casual use of the term was intended. I really am working on smoothing the street and 25mph small off road stuff out. freeway chop and jarring washboard with potholes everywhere conditions.

---------- Post added at 08:27 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:10 AM ----------

the fox engineer i spoke to was interested in the idea of drilling the ride height ports (on the coilovers)to custom tune . even offered to send new sleeves if they did not work out.He did say that their shocks were geared toward informal racing. when guys are trying to pass each other driving fast this is what i am referring to. i think someone with more expertise in this area could make it work but this forum is really bias toward the go fast model. i like to go fast it is fun and smooths the ride but sometimes the conditions (narrow jeep sized trails) do not allow it . Me and everything inside the raptor are getting jackhammered.Hit 80 the freeway chop smoothes out hit 45 and the washboard ladened with potholes smoothes out it is remarkable with the 3.0 really.I think the issue is really with the coilovers more than the rear. sorry for the long post did not have time for a shorter one.

 

[ntm]

Are you running the RPG tuned 3.0's ?

Opening the ride zone port is a bad idea.
The internal bypasses, by nature of their construction, have very little damping at slow shaft speeds in the ride zone.
That's their Achilles heel, they are better because of their true position sensitivity, but are "loose" at low shaft speed/ low fluid flow conditions.

The best solution is an external bypass. As you've noted, the rear is good, it's the front that has a narrower performance envelope.

If you think the fox's are rough in your driving conditions, you should see what the icons are like, lol

 

[bstoner59]

when i spoke to fox they told me that their shocks were designed for folks that what to drive fast and hard offroad so really not much effort has gone in to tuning for hitting the small stuff going 25mph. my use of the term racing shocks is being taken literally(my fault) when a more casual use of the term was intended. I really am working on smoothing the street and 25mph small off road stuff out. freeway chop and jarring washboard with potholes everywhere conditions.

---------- Post added at 08:27 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:10 AM ----------

the fox engineer i spoke to was interested in the idea of drilling the ride height ports (on the coilovers)to custom tune . even offered to send new sleeves if they did not work out.He did say that their shocks were geared toward informal racing. when guys are trying to pass each other driving fast this is what i am referring to. i think someone with more expertise in this area could make it work but this forum is really bias toward the go fast model. i like to go fast it is fun and smooths the ride but sometimes the conditions (narrow jeep sized trails) do not allow it . Me and everything inside the raptor are getting jackhammered.Hit 80 the freeway chop smoothes out hit 45 and the washboard ladened with potholes smoothes out it is remarkable with the 3.0 really.I think the issue is really with the coilovers more than the rear. sorry for the long post did not have time for a shorter one.

I've ridden in some trucks with the Fox tuned 3.0s and they are on the stiff side. If you want to talk with Corey at RPG he can send you in the right direction to revalve your shocks if that's something you can do. RPG Fox shocks are tuned differently. PM your number and I can have Corey call.

 

[wanderfalk]

Are you running the RPG tuned 3.0's ?

Opening the ride zone port is a bad idea.
The internal bypasses, by nature of their construction, have very little damping at slow shaft speeds in the ride zone.
That's their Achilles heel, they are better because of their true position sensitivity, but are "loose" at low shaft speed/ low fluid flow conditions.

The best solution is an external bypass. As you've noted, the rear is good, it's the front that has a narrower performance envelope.

If you think the fox's are rough in your driving conditions, you should see what the icons are like, lol

when studying the drawings of the fox 3.0 the ports look like they could be opened 1/16 or 1/32 of an inch. how ever it is not known how the valving would be handled. it looks like a lot of the stiffness comes in the first inch of travel. i am not sure what constitutes slow shaft speed.but in the truck it feels like a rapid jack hammer. really it is not painful but i have empathy for my raptor and it reminds me of scotty of the enterprise screaming at kirk it is going to blow captain. if i could get to 45 it settles in smoother than i could hope for amazing really.

 

[ntm]

when studying the drawings of the fox 3.0 the ports look like they could be opened 1/16 or 1/32 of an inch. how ever it is not known how the valving would be handled. it looks like a lot of the stiffness comes in the first inch of travel. i am not sure what constitutes slow shaft speed.but in the truck it feels like a rapid jack hammer. really it is not painful but i have empathy for my raptor and it reminds me of scotty of the enterprise screaming at kirk it is going to blow captain. if i could get to 45 it settles in smoother than i could hope for amazing really.

Yup, that's a familiar feeling to me.
The icons are much worse yet, due to too much damping.

 

[wanderfalk]

Yup, that's a familiar feeling to me.
The icons are much worse yet, due to too much damping.

these fast rapid short vibrations are they considered slow shaft speed. i think slow shaft speed is encountered when in a rolling terrain. some times these terms can be counter intuitive .

---------- Post added at 10:33 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:28 PM ----------

could you expand on what you think would happen if you opened the bottom ports a small amount. i was thinking that the problem would be to improve the ride at slower speeds it might have a negative impact on faster speed.

---------- Post added at 10:39 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:33 PM ----------

what i really want to see is a picture of the new dsc setup . the bypass tubes on the rear make sense open the tube and the oil by passes the piston and reduces the compression rate. but twist a dial for high speed or low speed , the adjustment does not seem like it could be nearly as controlled as the rear.

 

[1ntheoc]

I have the RPG tuned Fox's up front and I agree with all the statements on their ride quality... faster is better and the "thunk" can be a little worrisome until you get used to it and uncomfortable on the street.

I really hope you guys come up with a simple valving solution or something of that nature to create the "perfect" shock, however, after a lot of thought and some experience of being in different vehicles, I really feel it's not going to happen.

I think the real "problem" (if you can even call it that), is the travel limitation. You're taking a relatively small amount of travel and trying to create soft, medium and firm zones, both for the street and offroad. I think it would work fine on a Razor, but take a 6k+ pound truck and I think we're asking for compromises with 12 inches of travel. If I were to guess, the real solution is to increase travel and use custom valved shocks.

I'm hoping someone can prove me wrong... because I'd love my truck to ride like my buddies long travel, LS1 powered buggy... but I'm not holding my breath.

Just my worthless .02 cents.

 

[ntm]

I have the RPG tuned Fox's up front and I agree with all the statements on their ride quality... faster is better and the "thunk" can be a little worrisome until you get used to it and uncomfortable on the street.

I really hope you guys come up with a simple valving solution or something of that nature to create the "perfect" shock, however, after a lot of thought and some experience of being in different vehicles, I really feel it's not going to happen.

I think the real "problem" (if you can even call it that), is the travel limitation. You're taking a relatively small amount of travel and trying to create soft, medium and firm zones, both for the street and offroad. I think it would work fine on a Razor, but take a 6k+ pound truck and I think we're asking for compromises with 12 inches of travel. If I were to guess, the real solution is to increase travel and use custom valved shocks.

I'm hoping someone can prove me wrong... because I'd love my truck to ride like my buddies long travel, LS1 powered buggy... but I'm not holding my breath.

Just my worthless .02 cents.

Exactly, trying to do too many things with to little travel.

these fast rapid short vibrations are they considered slow shaft speed. i think slow shaft speed is encountered when in a rolling terrain. some times these terms can be counter intuitive .

---------- Post added at 10:33 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:28 PM ----------

could you expand on what you think would happen if you opened the bottom ports a small amount. i was thinking that the problem would be to improve the ride at slower speeds it might have a negative impact on faster speed.

---------- Post added at 10:39 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:33 PM ----------

what i really want to see is a picture of the new dsc setup . the bypass tubes on the rear make sense open the tube and the oil by passes the piston and reduces the compression rate. but twist a dial for high speed or low speed , the adjustment does not seem like it could be nearly as controlled as the rear.

Washboard, square edged stuff is high shaft speed.
Steady state cornering, smooth g outs, etc. is slow shaft speed.
All the dsc will be is a flow restrictor, restricting oil flow into the reservoir.
Same as what icon uses basically, but with an extra valve for high/low.

The thunk I think is caused by very little compression or rebound damping in the ride zone. Feels like worn out shocks. Once you get more oil flowing through the bypass ports they smooth out.
Mine are much worse since I blew the shaft seals out of both of my coilovers the other day. Hit a medium sized g-out in -30 temperatures before the shocks had a chance to warm up...