4x4 hi and low, drags when turning...

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debate

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When I switch to 4hi or 4low, and make a turn, it feels like the system is binding. The truck actually wont even move unless you give it a decent amount of throttle and/or straighten out the wheel. If you're already moving and make a turn, this "binding" will actually slow the truck to a stop.

... anybody experience this, or have any ideas?

Sounds like the front differential ( ? ) is messed-up.
 
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puddle hunter

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either all my 4x4 trucks had this same problem or its normal. with your rear wheels, only one spins unless the limited slip kick in, and those wheels are always facing the same direction (they dont turn). when its in 4x4, both wheels are spinning together at the same speed. when you turn, one wheel goes a further distance (the outside wheel). if they attached, spinning at the same speed, going different distances (only by a few inches), one is going to drag. if its in the dirt, its not a big deal cuz theres less holding it back. on pavement, its a lot harder to drag something. hope that makes sense. im not the best at explaining these things.

That makes perfect sense and I even thought that at first, but did any of your trucks actually roll to a stop within 100 feet when making a turn at less than 20mph? Mine wont even roll forward, no throttle, if the wheel is turned at a slight angle.

JP7 I have a feeling this will be a popular thread.
I have binding too, and Ford can't figure it out so far. But I have the same experiences as you and agree that it isn't exactly right - my tech keeps telling me to break stuff so they can replace it under warranty.

What exactly has Ford looked at in your case? Is this ongoing even after taking it into the shop, or is it fixed temporarily, then returns?

I can understand a little drag from all the mechanical stuff interacting, but this feels like straight up binding. The 4low setting should pull forward at any steering angle, on any surface, without any throttle input, same as the 4hi setting.... but mine isn't doing it.
 

Steve-O

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That makes perfect sense and I even thought that at first, but did any of your trucks actually roll to a stop within 100 feet when making a turn at less than 20mph? Mine wont even roll forward, no throttle, if the wheel is turned at a slight angle.

hmmm, never really thought about that. i usually just keep it in 4x4 long enough to get unstuck, then switch back to 2 til i get stuck again.
 
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puddle hunter

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Ok, so the Ford tech says that what I experienced, is perfectly normal for asphalt and even some hard packed off road surfaces.

I'll bite for now. It just felt so severe that I HAD to get it looked at. Oh well.

On the upside, they checked my drive shaft and ordered me up one, that should be here by Friday. Yay!
 

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Puddle, I've had a similar curiosity. I've noticed the same thing up here in AK even on all the snow-packed and icy roads and parking lots. I run in 4x4 a lot up here and notice some front binding at more than moderate steering angles. My question is with the new Torsen Differential in my '12, shouldn't it be differentiating the speed of the wheels? This isn't a locked front diff like in my F-250, correct? Or, am I completely wrong?

either all my 4x4 trucks had this same problem or its normal. with your rear wheels, only one spins unless the limited slip kick in, and those wheels are always facing the same direction (they dont turn). when its in 4x4, both wheels are spinning together at the same speed. when you turn, one wheel goes a further distance (the outside wheel). if they attached, spinning at the same speed, going different distances (only by a few inches), one is going to drag. if its in the dirt, its not a big deal cuz theres less holding it back. on pavement, its a lot harder to drag something. hope that makes sense. im not the best at explaining these things.

Both rear wheels are not rotating together at the same speed just because you turn on 4x4. Entering 4x4 does nothing to the rear diff. However, if you engage the electrically locking rear differential, then they will rotate at the same speed because they are locked. I would agree with your statements if you are talking about most (at least heavy duty, I think) front diffs on 4x4s. My '04 F-250 binds like a beyotch because the front end is locked.
 

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That makes perfect sense and I even thought that at first, but did any of your trucks actually roll to a stop within 100 feet when making a turn at less than 20mph? Mine wont even roll forward, no throttle, if the wheel is turned at a slight angle.



What exactly has Ford looked at in your case? Is this ongoing even after taking it into the shop, or is it fixed temporarily, then returns?

I can understand a little drag from all the mechanical stuff interacting, but this feels like straight up binding. The 4low setting should pull forward at any steering angle, on any surface, without any throttle input, same as the 4hi setting.... but mine isn't doing it.

They've replaced the hub, and some acuating part that shoves it into 4wd - twice. Last check they found there was a loss in vaccuum pressure to engage the 4wd and the new parts seemed to cure that. But I still have a 'clunk' while in 4wd mode.

When I first got the truck, it didn't bind this much in 4wd on dry or wet conditions, nor should it. I've ran 4wd trucks for over 20 years and not had this issue unless the diff gearing was the wrong size in one axle. I'm pretty sure that's not the problem - but I have no time in the next few weeks to get it into the shop again.
 

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Both rear wheels are not rotating together at the same speed just because you turn on 4x4. Entering 4x4 does nothing to the rear diff. However, if you engage the electrically locking rear differential, then they will rotate at the same speed because they are locked. I would agree with your statements if you are talking about most (at least heavy duty, I think) front diffs on 4x4s. My '04 F-250 binds like a beyotch because the front end is locked.

i shouldve been more specific. i was talking about the front wheels. thanks for clearin that up
 

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When I switch to 4hi or 4low, and make a turn, it feels like the system is binding. The truck actually wont even move unless you give it a decent amount of throttle and/or straighten out the wheel. If you're already moving and make a turn, this "binding" will actually slow the truck to a stop.

All my new era fords have done this. Even an old 74' F-250 shop truck we had did this. Its all of what everyone has said. Its NORMAL for it to bind while in 4X4 mode. Your working all the drive points against each other. As you move fwd and turn, the front wheels, one or both depending on your axle type will work against the rear because they are not rolling in the same plain with each other. When the wheels are turned the force of the driving action is side ways to the rear wheels. When your in 2 wheel drive the front wheels turn at different ratios to each other and its fine because they are NOT connected to the rear drive axle in any way.

In 4 x 4 you have now tied atleast 3 axles together especially if the rear is locked or is a locker type. You turn more than say 5 or 10 degrees off straight on hard surfaces and you start to feel the effects. If you try and turn sharp on dry or grippy surfaces and gas it you can actually feel the truck try and almost hop as it shudders and turns! This is just the nature of the beast. NORMAL in my opinion. All my fords from my 94 ranger to my 98 F-150 04 FX4 and the Raptor. All have had P trac.

Do this and listen and it will give you a little more of a sensation of whats going on. Roll your windows down. Engage the electric lock rear end and make a tight circle at a slow speed. CRUNCH, slip, gravel slipping sounds will abound. The wheels will be fighting each other because they are now locked as a solid axle and the out side tire will be being dragged around the outside as the inside wheel acts as the pivot point. Watch a semi trailer being backed at an angle by the tractor. The trailer wheels all see forces from different angles and just grind away at the ground and each other. Same kinda thing.

Also, from way back, I am old remember, I always try and back up 10 or 15 feet after I disengage the 4 x 4. This will help asure that everything has disengaged from each other. All the drive dogs have backed away or out of their slots. Same thing if you have the bind as you discribed, just disengage the 4 x 4 featur and back up, straighten the wheel if ya can. Then proceed fwd. This should relieve any bind.

I have for years and still do engage the 4 x 4 when it wet out. I love being able to BLAST away at lights, drive through water without near as much hydro steer and I feel my braking is way better because it ties the front and rear together and does not allow the wheels to brake at different ratios, I E brake bias is reduced.

WOW! I have a typing cramp now. HAhahaa. I say totally Normal.

BDRAG
 
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puddle hunter

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Do this and listen and it will give you a little more of a sensation of whats going on. Roll your windows down. Engage the electric lock rear end and make a tight circle at a slow speed. CRUNCH, slip, gravel slipping sounds will abound. The wheels will be fighting each other because they are now locked as a solid axle and the out side tire will be being dragged around the outside as the inside wheel acts as the pivot point. Watch a semi trailer being backed at an angle by the tractor. The trailer wheels all see forces from different angles and just grind away at the ground and each other. Same kinda thing.

Also, from way back, I am old remember, I always try and back up 10 or 15 feet after I disengage the 4 x 4. This will help asure that everything has disengaged from each other. All the drive dogs have backed away or out of their slots. Same thing if you have the bind as you discribed, just disengage the 4 x 4 featur and back up, straighten the wheel if ya can. Then proceed fwd. This should relieve any bind.

I have for years and still do engage the 4 x 4 when it wet out. I love being able to BLAST away at lights, drive through water without near as much hydro steer and I feel my braking is way better because it ties the front and rear together and does not allow the wheels to brake at different ratios, I E brake bias is reduced.

WOW! I have a typing cramp now. HAhahaa. I say totally Normal.

BDRAG
What you've said is exactly what I hear and feel. Glad to see I'm not crazy. But like I said, I erred to the side of caution, simply because the binding felt soo severe.

I like the backing up idea too. It was odd to continue to feel the effects of the 4x4 system, even after disengaging and going back to 4x2. I'll have to try this the next time I'm out.

They've replaced the hub, and some acuating part that shoves it into 4wd - twice. Last check they found there was a loss in vaccuum pressure to engage the 4wd and the new parts seemed to cure that. But I still have a 'clunk' while in 4wd mode.
Did you actually lose the ability to engage 4wd or was this just a damaged part that was replaced?
 
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