Speaker balance and EQ

[Hush Car Audio]

Guy are you trying to educate me on audio lol? I'm very aware of what bass roll off is. Most 6.5" speakers will certainly play lower than 100hz. I'm not sure where you get your information. I'm not going to argue this but would like to see where you are coming up with said argument.

 

[Guy]

Not at all.

I think it’s important to share information for those who might be newer to the aftermarket audio world.

I’ll clarify my statements as they seem to be unclear.

A typical door speaker, 6.5, 5.75, 7 inch, etc. is not designed to perform as a subwoofer. It varies by brand and quality of speaker, but in general their Fs (resonant frequency) isn’t the same as their frequency response. For example, my 6.5 inch components have a frequency response or 40-6.5k. Their resonant frequency, however, is 65, which means a reasonable 24 decibel step off at 125HZ was an excellent starting point for tuning.

I don’t know of anyone who has any sort of experience in audio who would be tuning midrange speakers to play in a subwoofer range, do you? Sure, even crossed over, they’ll produce some lows, but that’s more to help smooth the transition from the mids to the sub. Now certainly, I have seen and personally listened to systems built and tuned with 6 and even 8 inch door subs that sounded fantastic, and one of the setups were free air, but in these scenarios they weren’t midrange door speakers. There were midrange speakers dedicated to that task.


the stock rear coaxial speakers on the Ford Raptors are tuned to cover low mid bass right up to a fairly brisk, crossed over tweeter. I’ve personally analyzed the signal using pink noise.

So no, this isn’t a great signal to use for a sub, but with a very good dsp you can straighten out a good portion of the signal and compensate for roll off. There is no point in doing that, however, with options like Amp, maestro, Etc.

The factory experience is tuned, or rather detuned, to try to be accommodating to passengers as well as the driver and focuses less on the sound stage, as evidenced by how poorly it sounds.

As an audio professional, Are you building systems with midrange speakers, standing in for subwoofers? Do you build and install systems as well as tune them or do you just sell equipment? There is a place for everyone, and this transparency lets people
Know where you’re coming from and what you can offer them. If you do build and tune systems as well, this would be good information to put out, as there might be people local to you looking for a soup to nuts solution.

Guy are you trying to educate me on audio lol? I'm very aware of what bass roll off is. Most 6.5" speakers will certainly play lower than 100hz. I'm not sure where you get your information. I'm not going to argue this but would like to see where you are coming up with said argument.

 

[Hush Car Audio]

I build systems daily and send tuning off to other people. I don't have the time to do the tuning but am capable of doing it. I also send off my enclosure builds for the same reason. That doesn't mean I can't build enclosure or understand how to. I don't recommend putting subs in the doors. I recommend mid-range speakers. We certainly have a different opinion on starting point for the mid-range speakers though. To each their own.

 

[Guy]

Hush,

That’s good to know. So if someone on here wanted to bring their truck to your shop, they could get a complete build, from start to finish. It doesn’t matter what you subcontract out, as long as the subs are doing work that meets your standards, I see no reason that’s not a viable model.

How would you tune midrange door speakers? I’m interested. I’m being serious. I can certainly tune on the fly and I have all of my current tunes, stored. I’d like to hear what your approach because I’m open to give it a try and am not resistant to something new. Everyone has their own little nuances and I like to learn. Dom has some of the best tuning tips I’ve ever gotten and I love learning from him and sharing info.

I don’t have door subs, but I have seen them done very well and heard them done very well. It definitely changes how and where you feel the low notes. I personally wouldn’t do it with my truck now but I won’t say I’ll never try it on a future vehicle or future build.

I build systems daily and send tuning off to other people. I don't have the time to do the tuning but am capable of doing it. I also send off my enclosure builds for the same reason. That doesn't mean I can't build enclosure or understand how to. I don't recommend putting subs in the doors. I recommend mid-range speakers. We certainly have a different opinion on starting point for the mid-range speakers though. To each their own.

 

[goblues38]

in a base 4 speaker + sub set up (i get components are 2 speakers each). your 6.5 speakers would start with your set up with an 80hz 6db high pass crossover point, then adjust from there.

you would move the point up or down based on ear test and using an analyzer. a 6db slope for the cross over is not as aggressive of a slope as a 12db slope. @ 6 db, it will play down to 40hz, but the lower frequencies get softer the lower the go.

you may set a 12db slope at 60hz, because everything under 60 drops off a cliff compared to a 6db slope. there is a reason for everything and you millage may very.

It is very difficult to say...x is better then y....becaue they all have their time and place when used correctly.

If you know the difference bewteen a 6db and a 12db crossover slope you are more educated then 90% of the people trying to build a "system"

 

[Guy]

I find it easier, for me, to tune with a 24 decibel slopes with this hardware. When I set up my RTA, it’s the way I can most comfortably get to a nice level starting point before I Start to fine tune it by ear.

Even with 12 decibels I was getting a fair amount of overlap and compounding frequencies.

I’m not currently crossed over at 125hz. I’m actually at 80 on my front mids with 24 decibel slopes. I started with 125 and 12 decibels but the overlap was still peaky.

My subs are crossed at 60 and there is admittedly some overlap on the RTA but that’s a bass heavy preference on my part. I’d have a very tough time trying to tune those with a 6 decibel slope. I think I could do 12, but the legends are peaky in spots and it gets exaggerated if there is too much overlap. I’d end up having to do a lot of speaker by speaker EQ work and sometimes that in itself just comes out funny, despite best intentions.

Im at 24 decibel slopes from my highs to mids as well but I do have the benefit of 2.75 inch drivers so a lot of frequencies are carved out and it’s tough to knit them all back together.

I’m going to play with 6 decibels though because there is no harm. I’ll see how it sounds and where I get with it. There aren’t any right or wrong answers per say. I’ll let you know how it goes.

in a base 4 speaker + sub set up (i get components are 2 speakers each). your 6.5 speakers would start with your set up with an 80hz 6db high pass crossover point, then adjust from there.

you would move the point up or down based on ear test and using an analyzer. a 6db slope for the cross over is not as aggressive of a slope as a 12db slope. @ 6 db, it will play down to 40hz, but the lower frequencies get softer the lower the go.

you may set a 12db slope at 60hz, because everything under 60 drops off a cliff compared to a 6db slope. there is a reason for everything and you millage may very.

It is very difficult to say...x is better then y....becaue they all have their time and place when used correctly.

If you know the difference bewteen a 6db and a 12db crossover slope you are more educated then 90% of the people trying to build a "system"

 

[Oldfart]

I find it easier, for me, to tune with a 24 decibel slopes with this hardware. When I set up my RTA, it’s the way I can most comfortably get to a nice level starting point before I Start to fine tune it by ear.

Even with 12 decibels I was getting a fair amount of overlap and compounding frequencies.

I’m not currently crossed over at 125hz. I’m actually at 80 on my front mids with 24 decibel slopes. I started with 125 and 12 decibels but the overlap was still peaky.

My subs are crossed at 60 and there is admittedly some overlap on the RTA but that’s a bass heavy preference on my part. I’d have a very tough time trying to tune those with a 6 decibel slope. I think I could do 12, but the legends are peaky in spots and it gets exaggerated if there is too much overlap. I’d end up having to do a lot of speaker by speaker EQ work and sometimes that in itself just comes out funny, despite best intentions.

Im at 24 decibel slopes from my highs to mids as well but I do have the benefit of 2.75 inch drivers so a lot of frequencies are carved out and it’s tough to knit them all back together.

I’m going to play with 6 decibels though because there is no harm. I’ll see how it sounds and where I get with it. There aren’t any right or wrong answers per say. I’ll let you know how it goes.

You lost me once you went past the specs of my last radio.

 

[Guy]

I’d love to have that vintage radio out on my back patio.

You lost me once you went past the specs of my last radio.