GEN 2 Intermittent No Crank No Start w/P06E9 Stored in PCM - Starter??

[raptortrav001]

I have a 2018 802A truck with 52k miles and zero engine/tune modifications on it other than disabling start/stop via FORscan. It will intermittently go into a no crank no start condition that occurs after a short trip of 5 to 10 miles. It typically happens if I pull up to a location and shut it down for 5 minutes to run inside a store or the office. When I come back and jump in to start is when it happens. Simply letting the truck sit for 10 minutes (30 mins one time) resolves the issue.

Using FORscan I pull P06E9 - Engine Starter Performance out of the PCM each time the issue occurs. I also get B108A - Start Button - Signal Stuck High but I'm petty sure that's from me mashing the start button trying to get it to come back to life. No other codes are stored in any modules. When the issue happens no warning messages are present on the instrument pack and time of day, ambient conditions, fuel level, keyfob batteries, and keyfobs themselves have no effect. The issue can go days to weeks without manifesting so it's annoying to pin down.

Here's where it gets weird... I'm sure most of you have noticed the fuel pump that cycles when the driver's door is unlocked and opened (this is normal). I've found that when the no start is about to occur, the fuel pump doesn't cycle and I don't hear the 3 or 4 clicks when I open the door. This is the bit that keeps me from thinking it's a starter. In addition to the stuff above, I have checked the following but found nothing.

• The battery is only a few months old but I've tested it using a Midtronics machine and it's all good.
• All battery connections are clean, tight, and properly installed.
• The connections at the starter were tight but I removed and cleaned them anyway.
• Fuses checked - none blown and all properly fitted

I ordered a starter from the local dealer and intend to replace it next week but that's a guess at this point. I'd appreciate any input if you guys have seen this before. Perhaps @FordTechOne has some input?

 

[Gen1TillDeath]

It SOUNDS like the starter. But you could have tested power at the solenoid when cranking. If you had the cranking amps and still wouldn’t start then yeah I would replace the starter first. But with all of the electronics going into these vehicles now a days, so many issues can stem or be caused from several different things. Not one symptom of an issue is gonna always be the same culprit unfortunately….

 

[smurfslayer]

Have you tried pulling the FORSCAN auto stop / start mod and performing a battery management system reset?

auto stop suppression via Forscan disables BMS.

 

[FordTechOne]

The starter performance DTC indicates that the PCM provided power and ground to the starter relay but did not see an engine RPM signal. So the issue comes down to wiring or the starter. As was mentioned, you’ll want to measure voltage at the starter solenoid when the issue is occurring. You should see within 0.5 of battery voltage present after pressing the start button.

 

[wagner262]

I think fordtechone is probably correct. I have seen in a previous gmc I had do this. Left me stranded a few times before the dtc indicated a crankshaft sensor. But wouldn’t even set a soft code prior to throwing the CEL.

 

[mur]

raptortrav001, what did you find out? Starter cure it?

 

[raptortrav001]

The saga continues... My biggest issue is still getting the truck into a failure condition so it can be diagnosed as it goes 4 or 5 weeks between occurrences. I've managed to get my FORSCAN hooked to it twice while the issue is live and (in addition to P06E9) also had P2681 stored for engine coolant bypass valve circuit open, both times. While the truck is in a no-start condition this NEW code is a hard fault and will not clear. As soon as the truck returns to a normal state the code clears. I tried unplugging the valve and it made no difference on the no-start condition. I'm thinking about removing the BJB and checking connections to it this weekend to see what I find.

To date::

• The battery - old one tested good but to be sure, replaced it with an Odyssey 94R and reset BMS using ForScan. (TBH I wanted this battery anyway)
• All battery connections are clean, tight, and properly installed.
• Starter fuses in BCM and BJB checked - none blown and all properly fitted. Swapped them with other fuses of the same rating to see if the problem moved to that circuit.
• No starter relay to check as it's integrated to the BJB
• All grounds removed, cleaned, retorqued
• The starter was replaced with a factory part and all connections are clean and tight.

 

[raptortrav001]

@mur SEE ABOVE

 

[Rick at FMS]

Any update on this? I had the same issues and error codes. Dealership replaced the starter and at first it seemed to resolve it but the issue has came back within just a couple months.

 

[raptortrav001]

@Rick at FMS I’ve suspected the integrated starter relay in the battery junction box the entire time, and was able to confirm it just yesterday. The issue has only occurred 4 times since January so it’s taken a bit of time. Each time the issue has occurred I have popped the hood and knocked on the top of the BJB with a small rubber mallet ( finely calibrated diagnostic device) that I’ve kept in the truck for this purpose. Each time I’ve done this the truck immediately fires up and the code clears using FORscan. I know from prior diag that pulling fuses and refitting doesn’t fix the issue so something on the inside has a poor connection and the starter relay is inside the BJB. I now have 4 times where the issue has happened and I’ll I’ve done is pop the hood, knock on the BJB with a little force, and she immediately fires up. Playing with it this afternoon I tried to go backwards and create the issue by knocking on the BJB but it had no effect. I’m going to look it up tomorrow in alldata and see what it takes to change it out.